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The myth of the eight-hour sleep

bbc.co.uk

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Re: The myth of the eight-hour sleep

#141

Post by nostrademons »

swah wrote: post #120
nostrademons wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find my acceptable waking points occur in 1.5 hour sleep cycles, and how many I need depends on how mentally taxing the stuff I'm working on is. For ordinary work, stuff I know how to do fairly well already, I need 8 hours. If I'm learning something new or putting in long hours that require concentration, I'll need 9.5 hours. If I'm thrown into a completely new situation - say, I need to decide the architecture of…

But how do you do this? You wake up and go to sleep again and again? I wake up naturally after 7 or 8 hours, would be kinda hard for me to sleep 11.5 hours.

I find that I'll often come up to a point of half-consciousness at about 8/9.5/11 hours, but as long as I don't sit up or get out of bed or start checking my e-mail on my phone, it's pretty easy to fall back asleep.

Whether I want to depends on how much mental activity I've been doing; I'm far more likely to think "That was a nice dream, I don't wanna get out of bed yet" if I've got a thorny challenging problem in my head than if I'm like "Gotta get into work and start coding."

Re: The myth of the eight-hour sleep

#142

Post by kylebrown »

cop359 wrote: post #113
mmwako wrote: post #2

Oh my God. This could change my life. One lifelong problem I've got is sleeping. I have great trouble falling asleep, and my sleeping patterns are very uncommon: some days I sleep 12 hours, some 5, but I'm usually very tired because of this. However, I used to think I had a "gift" of being really creative and having my best ideas just before sleep, just waking up, and during insomnia episodes. However, I've discovere…

"I had a "gift" of being really creative and having my best ideas just before sleep, just waking up, and during insomnia episodes." This is called Hypnogogia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypnogogia The only way I can definitely replicate it is to stay up all night. The next day I will feel a lot more creative, but at the same time a lot less coordinated, frequently tired and not able to concentrate on doing something…

I remember reading about a famous inventor (can't remember who, sorry) who purposefully induced this state by holding something in his hand which would make a noise when let go. While falling asleep, the object (say, a metal ball) would drop (into say, a metal bowl), making enough noise to wake him up just as he was falling asleep. If an idea came he would write it down, if not he would repeat the process.

Re: The myth of the eight-hour sleep

#143

Post by kylebrown »

bufo wrote: post #62

A great page about sleep cycles is this one http://www.supermemo.com/articles/polyphasic.htm

Hah, the Uberman's sleep schedule (six 20 minuted sessions totaling two hours of sleep per day). I remember trying that for a few days after seeing the kuro5hin article way back when. Supposed to take two weeks to adjust, but it was so painful after a few days that I lost faith and feared I getting caught in a hoax.

Re: The myth of the eight-hour sleep

#145

Post by sycren »

nostrademons wrote: post #141
swah wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But how do you do this? You wake up and go to sleep again and again? I wake up naturally after 7 or 8 hours, would be kinda hard for me to sleep 11.5 hours.

I find that I'll often come up to a point of half-consciousness at about 8/9.5/11 hours, but as long as I don't sit up or get out of bed or start checking my e-mail on my phone, it's pretty easy to fall back asleep. Whether I want to depends on how much mental activity I've been doing; I'm far more likely to think "That was a nice dream, I don't wanna get out of bed yet" if I've got a thorny challenging problem in my…

I think it also depends how much light you have in the room. I think you would find it easier to sleep longer if the room was still dark after 8 hours.

Re: The myth of the eight-hour sleep

#146

Post by vacri »

ars wrote: post #139
vacri wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So quote them. Xurinos is rightly pointing out the lack of referencing. By the way, I worked in sleep medicine, first as a medical tech, and then in technical support for the medical equipment. I never came across the idea that split sleep sessions was right or healthy, and never heard the sleep physicians or clinical specialists mention such a thing. It is far from "well accepted and known for decades", at least up…

References, many by Ekirch but not all: http://www.history.vt.edu/Ekirch/sleepcommentary.html http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Segmented_sleep http://www.historycooperative.org/journals/ahr/106.2/ah00034... http://www.sciencenews.org/sn_arc99/9_25_99/bob2.htm http://www.psychiatrictimes.com/sleep-disorders/content/arti... http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1365-2869.2008.... http://www.nature.com/scientificamer…

It's interesting that the references of yours that are scientific studies are all in the last 6 years (which is when I say I was more out of the loop). This is hardly "known and accepted for decades".

Re: The myth of the eight-hour sleep

#147

Post by refurb »

chollida1 wrote: post #33

My brother in law is a "sleep scientist" at UPenn. His recommendation is that sleep cycles typically happen in 4 hour intervals so it's best to sleep 4 or 8 hours a night. Getting up int he middle of a sleep cycle is often as bad as getting less than 4 hours of sleep. And going to bed drunk is the worst for your sleep cycle.

I can believe this. One time I had 2 hours to sleep where I normally get 7 or 8 a night. I felt way worse the next day then if I hadn't slept at all. It was like my fight or flight response went haywire and I felt jittery and anxious all day.

Re: The myth of the eight-hour sleep

#148

Post by cinquemb »

Xurinos wrote: post #29

There is only one study in this article, and it involves how a group of people adapted to a 14-hour sleep pattern. Other than that, there are no studies of importance here, nothing that confirms concretely that this kind of segmented sleep is effective for humans. It is based on historical hearsay but cannot make a prescriptive judgment. The evidence purely anecdotal. Please be careful in reading things like this tha…

Like people now who just believe blindly now about the way they feel they should live their life by the norms?

It goes both ways.

Re: The myth of the eight-hour sleep

#149

Post by kamaal »

cleaver wrote: post #125
VonLipwig wrote: post #42

I am really into 'do what works for you'. You may find that that sleeping in two 4 hour blocks changes your life. You feel alive! Alternatively you may find yourself more tired. Personally I like sleeping 8-9 hours a night. I find myself fairly alert a few minutes after I wake up and I can start my day. It certainly doesn't feel 'unnatural' to me. I am also a big fan of sleeping when other people sleep so I can enjoy…

I once got caught up on sleep over a period of several weeks. I then started falling into the segmented sleep pattern like in the article. I didn't get out of bed when I woke up, but I found I was extremely lucid. As soon as I could use the time for problem solving, I stopped waking up :(

When you work extremely hard, beat the odds, you are too tired and haven't slept, and then manage to reach a milestone.

You suddenly begin to feel a sweet sense of pain. The feeling is just so beautiful that it feels amazing.

I've had that feeling quite a few number of times. And I will do anything to feel like that again.

Re: The myth of the eight-hour sleep

#150

Post by kamaal »

pavelkaroukin wrote: post #55
metatronscube wrote: post #21

I have never slept for 8hrs, not even close. I sometimes wonder how people can sleep for that long and what their jobs and life's must be like. After 5-7hrs I usually wake up feeling totally refreshed and ready to go (even better after my first coffee ;))

You are lucky :) Some math - 1 hour a day less sleep than "normal" people give you: 1 hr * 365 days / 24 hours in day ~ 15 days. And these are 24hours day. What it really should be: 1 hr * 365 days / (24 hours in day - 6 hours you sleep on average) ~ 21 days. Which is, well, in office terms, work month :) congrats, you got 1/12 life for free :)

I don't think sleep can be counted out of life.

Dreams are the most beautiful things to ever happen to humans. I have always lived two lives one in dreams and one while am awake.

And some experiences that I've had dreaming just can't be had while I'm awake.

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