Major Reddit communities will go dark to protest threat to third-party apps • Hacker News Board

Re: Major Reddit communities will go dark to protest threat to third-party apps

#141

Post by evandale » Mon, Jun 05, 2023, 3:28 PM UTC

I hope something new comes along. I'm getting sick of reddit. They way they allow moderators to run subreddits nowadays is ridiculous. Especially city subreddits that should be completely unbiased and welcoming to all in the region.

The r/Toronto city subreddit is absolute garbage now because of what the mods have done. They decided they would have "no-crime January" as a trial to see what the subreddit looks like if users weren't allowed to post articles about petty crime throughout the city. When someone gets stabbed in a high-profile area it couldn't be posted under the no-crime January rules. They said they would run it as a trial and offer a survey to see what people thought. They didn't run the survey and the rule is now in place permanently. Of course, when a white guy or incel commits a crime it's allowed, but if it's a BIPOC? Deleted.

Now the mods are trying to astroturf the municipal election we have coming up and push one of the candidates. It's the "progressive" candidate and in true Canadian fashion, if you don't vote for the progressive the reddit mob wants you to vote for you might as well be a Conservative because you're handing them the election. The mods allow people to make posts that say nonsense such as:

> To all Progressives - we need to consolidate behind [redacted] now. [He/she] might not be my first choice but this is finally an election where we can put a people-first person in. We can't screw this up by splitting the vote.

To suggest you can be a progressive but want another candidate will result in downvotes and insults. Funny enough, those insults would get you banned under their famous Rule 2 which basically allows them to delete or ban anything they deem as "not excellent" but when directed at someone who is seen as "conservative" they are allowed. The subreddit has been like this for about 5-6 years, it's only the political polarization that's got more extreme lately.

Re: Major Reddit communities will go dark to protest threat to third-party apps

#142

Post by not_a_shill » Mon, Jun 05, 2023, 3:28 PM UTC

idlewords wrote: post #121

not_a_shill wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like it's obvious? They want 3rd party apps to stay in some reasonable capacity. The definition of reasonable can vary, (free - low cost API usage), but it's not that important.

Articulating a clear demand is extremely important; it demonstrates that you have some organizational capacity beyond saying no.

The demand is clear enough, I don't know why you're just repeating that it isn't

Re: Major Reddit communities will go dark to protest threat to third-party apps

#143

Post by stuff4ben » Mon, Jun 05, 2023, 3:28 PM UTC

princevegeta89 wrote: post #128

chillbill wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The aim is not _just_ to make money, but to force users to use their crappy app so they can track users better. Sort of like what Twitter did. It’s also why they had like one dude working on their mobile website one hour a month for the last few years.

And the official Reddit apps sucks big ass in my opinion. Combine this with the way Reddit nags and misleads you to install it, and that gave me enough reason to never use their fucking app.

Having tried to use Apollo several times over several years, I keep coming back to the official Reddit app. It works and I'm just used to it. I like the UI much better and it feels normal. Nothing Apollo provides was that much of an improvement over the default app IMO.

Re: Major Reddit communities will go dark to protest threat to third-party apps

#144

Post by FourHand451 » Mon, Jun 05, 2023, 3:28 PM UTC

idlewords wrote: post #110

FourHand451 wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that's good advice in principle, but the practical limitation is the ability of a bunch of redditors to come to an agreement on point #2 on short notice. Maybe they figure the implied message of "you are doing a bad thing we don't like. Don't do the bad thing" may be enough to get some change to happen, if change is a real possibility.

If you can't come together around even one demand, then the message your protest conveys to management is that you are momentarily upset but there is zero risk in ignoring you.

I agree that making a clear demand seems more effective if possible, but I don't think disorganization necessarily implies that displeasure is only momentary and involves no risk. Many people can be upset about something and agree on a way to protest it without agreeing on what the solution should be.

Re: Major Reddit communities will go dark to protest threat to third-party apps

#145

Post by thomastjeffery » Mon, Jun 05, 2023, 3:30 PM UTC

tiahura wrote: post #30

While I’m sure Reddit has some wonderful woodworking or music discussions, its main function is to be the shit that attracts flys and keeps them away from sites like this.

The same argument can be applied to itself: popular subreddits attract users away from niche subreddits.

There are many thriving niche subreddits. Maybe the "main function" of Reddit is categorization? If so, it seems reasonably effective, so long as people feel motivated enough to moderate those subreddits. That's the issue at hand.

Re: Major Reddit communities will go dark to protest threat to third-party apps

#146

Post by 369548684892826 » Mon, Jun 05, 2023, 3:32 PM UTC

Gareth321 wrote: post #118

wmurmann wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What’s so crappy about it? I’ve seen some bad apps and it’s definitely not that bad. Can you elaborate?

The design language follows all modern social media apps: engagement. Think TikTok. This means auto-playing videos, large elements instead of small elements (low information density) designed to draw attention, prioritising popular and contentious items in the feed instead of relevant items for the user, etc. This language is user-hostile. It uses psychological techniques to keep users on the platform for longer inst…

> auto-playing videos, large elements instead of small elements

You can fix both these issues in the app settings. Turning off feed thumbnails is also a big improvement.

Re: Major Reddit communities will go dark to protest threat to third-party apps

#147

Post by chickenpotpie » Mon, Jun 05, 2023, 3:32 PM UTC

Timpy wrote: post #69

If I understand this correctly, these third party apps are drawing tons of ad money away from Reddit while at the same time increasing their hosting costs and dev costs for maintaining the API, right? How is this not a win-win for Reddit? They lower the traffic that was costing them money. I know it's user-hostile and that's the crux of the complaints, but it seems a little naive that these communities are basically…

Imagine you own a store. Every week 2 people come in. They talk and shop for a long time. You spend a lot of money showing them all the products and answering their questions. One of the two spends always buys a ton of stuff and the other one never buys anything. You realize you can save a lot of time and money by banning the other person since they never buy anything. Next week, neither of them come in.

Thats reddit. The people that use the first party app and click ads and make money do it because of the content created by both the first party and third party app users.

Re: Major Reddit communities will go dark to protest threat to third-party apps

#148

Post by not_a_shill » Mon, Jun 05, 2023, 3:33 PM UTC

idlewords wrote: post #138

thomastjeffery wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems pretty clear to me, given the context: Dear Reddit, You are about to do a bad thing. Don't do that thing, or I will leave your platform. kthnxbai

Read their post! It's impossible to tell which of these, if any, they want: - roll back all API pricing changes to the status quo ante - Offer more reasonable pricing tiers, for some value of 'more reasonable' - do what you want with the API, but give moderators the tools they need (right now only available in third party apps) - something else

So they communicated to you that it's a combination of all the above. You're just being difficult for the sake of being difficult here.

Re: Major Reddit communities will go dark to protest threat to third-party apps

#149

Post by dabluecaboose » Mon, Jun 05, 2023, 3:33 PM UTC

kodt wrote: post #105

TheChaplain wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Reddit is garbage these days anyways. Not really, there are a bunch of small reddits that really is a good source of information and community. E.g. r/leathercraft, r/learnmath, r/godot and so on...

Basically if the sub gets popular enough to reach the front page, you are in trouble. If it stays small, then you can still have a decent community.

The sub also needs to get big enough to get out of the "Facebook group" mentality, and have at least one competent mod that keeps it from turning into memes and shitposting.

It's a tricky balance. I've been in small (~sub 500) subreddits that are worse than larger ones just because the mods don't enforce any posting requirements.

Re: Major Reddit communities will go dark to protest threat to third-party apps

#150

Post by Eisenstein » Mon, Jun 05, 2023, 3:35 PM UTC

LanceH wrote: post #140

Eisenstein wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reddit is built on free labor from mods. Without the mods they would have to pay people to moderate thousands (hundreds of thousands?) of communities. Most mods use old reddit on desktop or third party apps on mobile because their app and new site suck for modding. Alienating the mods means their subreddits go to shit, and reddit exists for content. Doesn't sounds like a 'win' to me.

Reddit moderation isn't some altruistic effort. It's people shaping the discussion of their subreddit. They are participants as much as any other user.

Sure. And if you piss them off they will leave.