Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Oh, the Places Your Apple ID Will Go

pxlnv.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

141–150 of 164 posts

Re: Oh, the Places Your Apple ID Will Go

#141

Post by RunSet »

AshamedCaptain wrote: post #87
whywhywhywhy wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don’t, they try to obscure it but you can still install without a Microsoft Account.

At some point, when you have to go find the disassembler and start monkey patching binaries, some people will still say "but there's still a workaround!".

Reminds me of how Firefox removed the ability to set a URL for new tabs (the better to display advertising on them) but justified it by saying "Users can trust and install a third-party extension to enable that functionality."

Re: Oh, the Places Your Apple ID Will Go

#142

Post by newaccount74 »

scarface74 wrote: post #93
amelius wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why don't apps show the EU cookie banner? It seems that apps have an unfair advantage over websites.

Unfair advantage == it isn’t a usability nightmare caused by ignorant lawmakers

The usability nightmare is not caused by lawmakers. The usability nightmare is caused by businesses who think they need to put Google analytics on every single page.

It is possible to create websites completely without cookie banners. You just have to not track your customers unnecessarily.

Re: Oh, the Places Your Apple ID Will Go

#143

Post by [deleted] »

gunapologist99 wrote: post #115

Apple’s analytics data include an ID called “dsId”. We were able to verify that “dsId” is the “Directory Services Identifier”, an ID that uniquely identifies an iCloud account. Meaning, Apple’s analytics can personally identify you. Apple states in their Device Analytics & Privacy statement that the collected data does not identify you personally. Even if legal, this is obviously a very bad look for a company that cl…

[deleted]

Re: Oh, the Places Your Apple ID Will Go

#144

Post by scarface74 »

newaccount74 wrote: post #142
scarface74 wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfair advantage == it isn’t a usability nightmare caused by ignorant lawmakers

The usability nightmare is not caused by lawmakers. The usability nightmare is caused by businesses who think they need to put Google analytics on every single page. It is possible to create websites completely without cookie banners. You just have to not track your customers unnecessarily.

I love how GDPR apologists love to deflect blame from the law and lawmakers who were the initial cause of the problem.

And what affect did have? Did the 99 section 11 chapter law have any deleterious affect on adTech? Did it make browsing better or worse?

We see the effect that of an effective strategy, when Apple made tracking opt in, publicly traded companies like FB admitted that it caused billions in lost revenue.

The only thing the GDPR did was give us cookie banners.

Re: Oh, the Places Your Apple ID Will Go

#145

Post by timmg »

cmeacham98 wrote: post #4

> I may be getting something wildly wrong here, but I am not sure I see the presence of this Apple ID proxy in Apple’s services logs to be a violation of either its own policies or users’ expectations for using internet services in general. I strongly disagree that the iOS App Store should be treated as an "internet service" rather than a part of the device. The iOS App Store only comes on iOS devices, it comes on al…

> I strongly disagree that the iOS App Store should be treated as an "internet service" rather than a part of the device.

It's also on the web, e.g.: https://apps.apple.com/us/app/facebook/id284882215

Which means apps, for example, show up on Google searches.

Re: Oh, the Places Your Apple ID Will Go

#146

Post by dang »

Recent and related:

Apple sends DSID with iPhone analytics data, tests show - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33695937 - Nov 2022 (111 comments)

Proposed class action alleges that Apple tracks users despite privacy assurances - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33593455 - Nov 2022 (191 comments)

App Store on iOS 14.6 sends every tap you make in the app to Apple - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33520775 - Nov 2022 (190 comments)

Re: Oh, the Places Your Apple ID Will Go

#147

Post by quickthrower2 »

Semaphor wrote: post #49
quickthrower2 wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Windows is now entirely an internet service as you need a microsoft account and internet connection to install it.

Source? Because last I checked, local accounts were discouraged but worked.

I got through 3 new lenovos with windows 11. One purchase but returned 2 due hardware issues. Installed windows about 3 or 4 times

Re: Oh, the Places Your Apple ID Will Go

#148

Post by gcanyon »

sneak wrote: post #131
gunapologist99 wrote: post #115

Apple’s analytics data include an ID called “dsId”. We were able to verify that “dsId” is the “Directory Services Identifier”, an ID that uniquely identifies an iCloud account. Meaning, Apple’s analytics can personally identify you. Apple states in their Device Analytics & Privacy statement that the collected data does not identify you personally. Even if legal, this is obviously a very bad look for a company that cl…

Apple is only about privacy as a marketing differentiator. Apple's software clearly demonstrates that they do not place a high value on user privacy. iPhones and Macs phone home constantly with all sorts of information even if you never use iCloud or the App Store or Apple's service offerings. It's ridiculous.

I'm curious: do you think Apple is exactly as invasive as the companies they compare themselves to? Or are they not as invasive, but still not as non-invasive as their marketing materials claim?

Re: Oh, the Places Your Apple ID Will Go

#149

Post by gcanyon »

withinboredom wrote: post #139
glitchc wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, that's not the definition of PII. That the ID maps to a person doesn't mean they know that person's SSN, which is PII. IP counts as metadata. It uniquely identifies you as an entity but does not reveal other details except geographic location. If IP addresses are PII, then any use of the internet is violating your privacy. Perhaps unplug your modem, turn off cell service on all devices and read a book instead.

That's literally the definition, it's in the name. If it can be used to personally identify you in any way, it's PII. Yes, IP addresses are PII and there's nothing that prevents you from storing PII for reasonable amounts of time (i.e., to process a packet, a purchase, or fulfill a contract). Where you get into trouble with various laws is when you store them for other purposes (such as in logs) and use them in ways…

I think the point being made is that there are two classes of information: 1. That which helps distinguish a single human being as distinct from another. 2. That which provides you with some useful knowledge about that human being.

Knowing an IP address can distinguish user A from user B, but unless you know something else about A vs. B, what's the point?

Re: Oh, the Places Your Apple ID Will Go

#150

Post by scarface74 »

smoldesu wrote: post #130
scarface74 wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every app can have iCloud associated data that would be deleted when you uninstall the app. Also push notifications go through Apple’s servers and then Apple bundles them for different apps. Apple would need to know not to send push notifications to an app that is no longer installed. Also of course Apple keeps a record of installed apps. If you drop your phone in the ocean and go to the Apple Store to buy a new one,…

iCloud is the problem, here. Apple has no right to predecate my software usage on the existence of an account with them. It's equally as absurd as Windows requiring a Microsoft ID to log in.

Then don’t buy an Apple device?

Apple for over 40 years has sold integrated software and hardware and for over 20 has sold hardware + integrated online services (iPod+ iTunes) and now you are shocked that when you buy an Apple device you also buy into their ecosystem?

Exactly how is anything on the iPhone suppose to work without an account? Push notifications?

Most Android apps are also dependent on Google services and a Google account.

Post reply on HN