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The Story of Mel (1983)

cs.utah.edu

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Re: The Story of Mel (1983)

#141

Post by User23 »

ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #34
Torifyme12 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The developer time is saved by not writing multiple apps, fuck the end user, who cares about their time? Seriously, I have to really think about when was the last time there wasn't some degree of unnecessary friction in an application. It really feels like being an end user of modern tech is like being in an abusive relationship.

> It really feels like being an end user of modern tech is like being in an abusive relationship. I've come to realize that a lot of modern developers consider users of their tech to be little more than cattle. The tech is cattle feed, meant to fatten and ensnare the user, so they can be sold off and slaughtered. There's really only one party in that kind of relationship that benefits.

There's that old joke that only two industries call their customers "users."

Re: The Story of Mel (1983)

#142

Post by wawjgreen »

phkahler wrote: post #48
wawjgreen wrote: post #46

seems like yet another trip down the past-huggery and a penchant for doing-things-the-hardway. Real programmers don't write write-only code.

>> Real programmers don't write write-only code. He did figure out how the program exited the loop, it just took him 2 weeks.

hehehe.

Re: The Story of Mel (1983)

#143

Post by foobarbecue »

retrac wrote: post #104
foobarbecue wrote: post #53

I like this new word "esthetics"! It's like a cross between ethics and aesthetics. How to do the right thing and make it look good too, I guess!

It's just a variant spelling of aesthetics.

Hm. Aesthetics really doesn't make sense in the context. Ethics does.

Re: The Story of Mel (1983)

#144

Post by foobarbecue »

adrianmonk wrote: post #105
foobarbecue wrote: post #53

I like this new word "esthetics"! It's like a cross between ethics and aesthetics. How to do the right thing and make it look good too, I guess!

I think it's just a spelling variation. "Ae" or "æ" does show up in English words sometimes, but a lot of times it gets simplified to "e" (probably closer to the pronunciation). Examples: "aeon"/"eon", "caesium"/"cesium", "paediatrician"/"pediatrician", "anaesthesia"/"anesthesia", "haemoglobin"/"hemoglobin", and "chimaera"/"chimera". And more debatably, "daemon"/"demon" and "aeroplane"/"airplane". Generally, British…

Hm. Aesthetics really doesn't make sense in the context. Ethics does.

Re: The Story of Mel (1983)

#145

Post by worik »

This is a story of what not to be.

Much better eating quiche!

I have known some modern versions of Mel. Horrible arrogant blissfully ignorant (and usually) bullies.

Re: The Story of Mel (1983)

#146

Post by chimeracoder »

pfarrell wrote: post #16

This page [0] includes an analysis of the manual for the possible machine Mel programmed in the story along with a probable photograph of him. [1] is an instruction manual for the blackjack program itself, written by Mel. Classic story solidly in the “should be reposted every six months or so” cohort. 0: https://www.freecodecamp.org/news/macho-programmers-drum-mem... 1: http://bitsavers.trailing-edge.com/pdf/royalPre…

> I did eventually manage to get in contact with Mel, but I scared him away, unfortunately. That's a story for another day... :-/

I'm... very curious what this entailed

Re: The Story of Mel (1983)

#147

Post by eob »

mlyle wrote: post #115
username223 wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I bought the Hackers Dictionary by Eric S. Raymond That hurts a bit to read. Raymond is/was a huckster who took the original Hackers Dictionary, a communal MIT project, and made some edits. He went on to annoy the Linux community with his CML2 antics around the build system. Lisp/MIT, BSD, and Linux all have their own histories, a mixture of forgettable drama and fundamental difference.

> a communal MIT project, and made some edits The Jargon File had been dead and dated for nearly a decade when he picked it up. His maintenance and publication was an important part of making this content relevant and accessible to future generations. Eric Raymond's work is a mix of good and bad-- like you could say about anyone.

Oh interesting -- I didn't know any of the above Raymond controversy (or even really who he was; the name just is etched in my brain from that book)

As a guy who found the Jargon File via that book, I'm grateful he did it. But I can see how publishing an edit of an online forum would ruffle a lot of feathers: 30 years later you get guys like me attributing it all to him.

Re: The Story of Mel (1983)

#148

Post by jart »

jhbadger wrote: post #96
jart wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of that ethos I think is just Generation X plus computers. A rebellious generation that came of age during a time when digital technology had just granted kids the power to wardial norad. I think tinkerers have always been timeless, but that kind of cyberpunk culture is something we're unlikely to see again.

I'm solidly GenX, but the hacking culture described by "The Hacker's Dictionary" is a generation older than that -- the era of the MIT AI Lab or Stanford's SAIL in the mid 1970s. Lisp Machines and custom in-house operating systems. The GenX hacking culture was the 1980s and was more about getting the most out of our own microcomputers.

Oh believe me I know it has origins in ivory towers like MIT. Stallman has written all about that for instance. The context with GP was once it had trickled down into more popular culture with the ESR / Jargon File days. We honestly don't know a lot of the true origins of hacker culture, because so much of it started in corporate government enclaves with confidentiality rules. What we know are echos of practices and socialization that crystalized into usenet posts.

Re: The Story of Mel (1983)

#149

Post by mlyle »

eob wrote: post #147
mlyle wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a communal MIT project, and made some edits The Jargon File had been dead and dated for nearly a decade when he picked it up. His maintenance and publication was an important part of making this content relevant and accessible to future generations. Eric Raymond's work is a mix of good and bad-- like you could say about anyone.

Oh interesting -- I didn't know any of the above Raymond controversy (or even really who he was; the name just is etched in my brain from that book) As a guy who found the Jargon File via that book, I'm grateful he did it. But I can see how publishing an edit of an online forum would ruffle a lot of feathers: 30 years later you get guys like me attributing it all to him.

The introduction makes it pretty clear the sourcing: http://catb.org/jargon/html/revision-history.html (This appears in the printed book, too).

Most of the criticism of his stewardship of the jargon file and the publication as N.H.D. by MIT Press comes after other controversies.

Re: The Story of Mel (1983)

#150

Post by oaiey »

mlyle wrote: post #133
oaiey wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was 17 to 19 at the time. We had everything, from math, physics, electronics, chip design (board layout simulation etc), micro processors (and after a year assembler on a DOS PC), networking, operating systems (mainframe + Unix + NT), C, Pascal, VBA. Add generic programming, English, project management and some other courses you need for soft skills. 18 months, 40 hours a week, two tests a week all with a full stip…

Wow-- that's really awesome-- a very deep generalist curriculum. This is along the lines of what I'd like to ultimately create. It's hard, though, because I am offering this in the form of electives, and students have limited slots to fill and as they get older their willingness to take any risk in selecting a class decreases. I teach in both high school and middle school, and I've found I can be a lot "bolder" in wh…

IMHO middle and high school do not have the life focus and specialization yet. Hacking on a microprocessor trainer is no fun and definitely does not bring you anything if you are not in CS and even then you can survive without.
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