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Break Up The Elite College Seats Cartel

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141–150 of 237 posts

Re: Break Up The Elite College Seats Cartel

#141
post #19

Its not like those schools are demonstrably better its that those schools are exclusive and provide social connections to elite social classes. The whole point of them existing is to be exclusive more than it is to educate.

Admissions is an imprecise art. While the majority of elite school students make do with status and connections, some go on to attain global stature.

Global stature is virtually impossible to attain, an unrealistic goal. The world is actually a small place, and global stature is a reasonable goal within one's domain of interest. Both views are indisputably true. One tends to believe the view held by people around you. While it's easy to become a student at an elite school, it's hard to become a professor at an elite school. These are people who have "cracked the code" and naturally see the world as a small place in which one can excel. Most students will never "crack this code", but those in direct contact with good role models are more likely to do so.

Re: Break Up The Elite College Seats Cartel

#142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We need more MITs and Caltechs, not more Harvards and Yales. While this is a very crass over-generalization, I've found you really see this in the graduates. I've found Ivy league school graduates to be sort of... disconnected from reality? Like experts in education who clearly don't understand any of the on-the-ground realities of teaching (your lesson plan is beautifully structured, but we can't use it because it…

At my old job in the UK, we always got better results hiring engineers from Imperial College (which is the UK attempt at an MIT/Caltech-type of school) than from Oxbridge. We eventually figured out that the Imperial students had written thousands and thousands of lines of code by the time they graduated, in several different types of languages (Prolog, Haskell, C, Verilog, Java, Python, Javascript) and at all levels…

The Imperial kids also do a lot of internships and summer jobs, and are often the kind of alpha nerds who have serious side projects. I interview and work with a lot of interns and graduate hires from Imperial (and a few from Oxford and even other universities), and i'm highly dubious that the work they do during their actual course is whey they are learning to program.

Re: Break Up The Elite College Seats Cartel

#144
post #33

Status is zero sum, so it’s not even possible to create an arbitrary amount of elite schools to begin with.

This is what these discussions always miss. Harvard isn't conferring value, its recognizing it. It's not a value add, its a filter. People think you can create value by creating more elite universities, but it's exactly the opposite. All you're going to do is destroy the signal they provide. You can learn just as much at a non-elite university as an elite one. Attending an elite university just means you were in the…

[deleted]

Re: Break Up The Elite College Seats Cartel

#145
post #140

The situation as seen from France is odd. Here, elite STEM universities are free, and the very best ones even pay their students. Having legacy admissions would be unthinkable; it's the opposite of meritocracy. And you don't need to "socially" prepare since birth with all the right extra-curricular activities.

French universities absolutely do have legacy admissions. It's called admissions paralleles (or sur dossier), you can pay your way in with minimal effort and get the same diploma upon graduation.

Re: Break Up The Elite College Seats Cartel

#146

It would make a lot of sense for the top schools to expand like they did in other countries. Oxford and Cambridge have 12,000 undergrads each. University of Toronto has 44,000. Harvard and Princeton have about 5,000 each and Stanford has like 8,000. The US has more top schools, perhaps, than other countries, but not as many seats, I think.

I think one of the keys issues is the US News ranking criteria. US News took the easy way out with respect to two significant components of the score [1]. - Endowment per student - bonus points for amassing the largest treasure per fewest students - Selectivity - bonus points for excluding people before they come in which has no bearing on the effectiveness of the school itself in educating Also a large percentage we…

Amazing how a failed legacy media company from the 1950s managed to stay afloat until today simply by publishing a list of colleges in unscientific and largely arbitrary order.

The amazing thing is US News still pretends to publish news—-likely just to add legitimacy to the college ranking business.

Re: Break Up The Elite College Seats Cartel

#148
post #129
post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because very few young people would list Saudi Arabia as place to visit, even for free. Starting with a $10b endowmwnt in North America, Europe, or East Asia would probably create a noteworthy university inside 15 years.

Millions of people go to Saudi Arabia yearly...

Do you mean for religious pilgrimage to Mecca? That’s different from what the OP is talking about.

Re: Break Up The Elite College Seats Cartel

#149
Ivies spend about 5% of their endowment a year on operating costs, so endowments have to increase each year enough to keep the school running AND beat inflation.

If you tax Harvard’s endowment 80% from $50B to $10B, suddenly it’s spending 25% of its endowment per year, so its endowment would need to increase every year by 25% plus inflation — clearly impossible. (So it would have to cut spending, fire faculty + staff, and offer less financial aid to disadvantaged students.)

University endowments aren’t just shoved into a treasure chest somewhere. They are actively reinvested into the economy to generate a return. For example, universities are some of the best VC LPs. They’re actively funding innovation and economic growth.

Re: Break Up The Elite College Seats Cartel

#150
post #129
post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because very few young people would list Saudi Arabia as place to visit, even for free. Starting with a $10b endowmwnt in North America, Europe, or East Asia would probably create a noteworthy university inside 15 years.

Millions of people go to Saudi Arabia yearly...

60% of college students are women. Do you think most women would want to study abroad in Saudi Arabia? Teach? Do research? Seems like you'll have a hard time becoming a notable university when you've alienated the most numerous category of academics.
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