New EU law could require iMessage and WhatsApp to work with other platforms • Hacker News Board

Re: New EU law could require iMessage and WhatsApp to work with other platforms

#141

Post by pabs3 » Sun, Mar 27, 2022, 1:15 AM UTC

tluyben2 wrote: post #139

pabs3 wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The banking API rule isn't that useful, you as a bank customer cannot get access to that bank's APIs, instead you have to go to another company who does have access.

Yes, like my company, who in turn make useful apps for consumers which was far harder (and more expensive) before. You had to jump through all kinds of hoops, you don't need to jump so many here in EU/UK. I did integrations in HK/AU/US and that was seriously painful without these in place. And far more expensive.

No offense, but trusting third-party companies with financial data is unlikely for many people, they are probably more likely to write a scraper for their bank's horrible web interface or reverse engineer their bank's mobile app than do that.

Re: New EU law could require iMessage and WhatsApp to work with other platforms

#142

Post by teekert » Tue, Mar 29, 2022, 10:53 AM UTC

stale2002 wrote: post #140

teekert wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And then we keep Moxie as a slave forcing him to get motivated to implement all this? Or will the government cease control of the code? Stop Moxie from Forking, then tell people to stay on the government branch? And the arguments hold for Meta too if you ask me. WhatsApp is not a public service. It was not build (or in this case bought later on) with our interests at the top of the priority list. If we want public se…

They don't have to be forced to do anything. If these companies do not want to follow these laws, then they are within their right to not operate in the EU.

This proposes a very strict link between what is good for a society and the law. We should continue to debate decisions like this because what is good for society is very difficult to prove but the law has real repercussions, right now.

Re: New EU law could require iMessage and WhatsApp to work with other platforms

#143

Post by fdeage » Tue, Mar 29, 2022, 4:53 PM UTC

sneak wrote: post #34

RenThraysk wrote: post #28

Is this an indirect attack on the encryption... seems to be.

iMessage and WhatsApp both already have encryption backdoors that escrow the endpoint secret keys or plaintext to cloud services, undermining the end-to-end encryption. That ship has sailed.

Not sure about this, but related: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22098473

The thing is, there doesn't appear to be any way to know whether this is the case.

Re: New EU law could require iMessage and WhatsApp to work with other platforms

#144

Post by stale2002 » Tue, Mar 29, 2022, 8:53 PM UTC

teekert wrote: post #142

stale2002 wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They don't have to be forced to do anything. If these companies do not want to follow these laws, then they are within their right to not operate in the EU.

This proposes a very strict link between what is good for a society and the law. We should continue to debate decisions like this because what is good for society is very difficult to prove but the law has real repercussions, right now.

The point being here, is that these companies do not "own" these citizens. Citizens have the right to vote. And they can vote on laws. And if companies want access to these markets, then they should follow these valid laws.

If you want to talk about the benefits and drawbacks of these laws, thats fine. But please do not phrase it as if these companies are being forced into slavery.

Because that is an absurd framing, because those citizens are fully within their right to set consumer protections, for what is required of companies, if they want access to certain markets.

Law makers, and everyone else, would love to talk about the benefits and cons, to consumers for these laws. Please enter the conversation, and actually talk about that, instead of pretending like these corporations have some moral right to access certain markets, above and beyond the wishes of those citizens who vote on valid consumer protections.

We are not "taking them from companies". Instead, citizens are putting up valid consumer protections and requirements for access to their market, that does not belong to these corporations.

And these corporations can decide to either follow these laws, or leave the market, because those markets do not belong to them.

Re: New EU law could require iMessage and WhatsApp to work with other platforms

#145

Post by lovingCranberry » Thu, Mar 31, 2022, 1:39 PM UTC

spacexsucks wrote: post #91

lovingCranberry wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe forcing to expose APIs would kill messengers which are built around a single feature (like snapchat). The idea behind snapchat is that it's hard for users to save images without notifying the opposite party. You wouldn't be able to enforce this with third party clients.

Which is the dumbest excuse to keep walled gardens

John, don't call other people's opinions dumb, just because you disagree. Encourage dialogue, not hostility.

While I'm against walled gardens, I can see why these companies want to keep them closed. And if I'd work for e.g. snap, I would probably have this opinion as well.

Sawing off the branch you are sitting on is usually not a good idea.