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Tell HN: Airbnb just stole me 5 minutes of my time adding dices

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Re: Tell HN: Airbnb just stole me 5 minutes of my time adding dices

#141

Post by bob1029 »

zeepzeep wrote: post #138
gandutraveler wrote: post #134

Why can't Google and apple solve the 'are you a human?' check at operating system level. As a user on mobile phone they are already tracking our clicks and should be easy to communicate that to the apps and browsers.

lol no thanks I'd rather not have an OS based tracking API, even worse for every website out there. Just dont use captchas. "Are you a human" is not something a website should know.

> "Are you a human" is not something a website should know.

This is the only long term solution as ML gets closer to AI.

If your website is fucked because it can't handle the traffic, that's better solved at the source (hardware/software/bandwidth)

If your website is fucked because someone can trivially scrape the most important bits from the web interface, you need to have a business conversation, not a technology conversation.

Re: Tell HN: Airbnb just stole me 5 minutes of my time adding dices

#142

Post by gpderetta »

thinkindie wrote: post #122
gpderetta wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, CAPTCHA is more like locking your store and then asking your customers to pick the lock.

I think CAPTCHAs are more fitting the analogy of metal detectors at banks or sensitive places.

It is a good analogy. On the other hand, it would be quite jarring if I had to go through a metal detector just to buy groceries.

On the third hand, I understand US schools have metal detectors these days, and in Beijing I had to go through a metal detector to hop on the metro, so what do I know...

Re: Tell HN: Airbnb just stole me 5 minutes of my time adding dices

#143

Post by gpderetta »

mnd999 wrote: post #132
cbg0 wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're comparing solving a typically simple puzzle with breaking and entering.

Breaking and entering is not particularly difficult, in fact it's probably easier than a lot of CAPTCHAs. The reason people inclined to do illegal / immoral things don't do it is the likelihood of getting caught and the consequences therein. Of course most people aren't spammers or burglars so in most cases it doesn't matter.

The Lockpicking Lawyer should publish videos comparing times to break a locks vs solving captchas :)

Re: Tell HN: Airbnb just stole me 5 minutes of my time adding dices

#144

Post by billpg »

ianpurton wrote: post #71

Captchas are often used to prevent credential stuffing where an attacker has a list of email addresses and passwords and runs a script to try those out on different sites. They also help prevent password brute force, i.e. an attacker has your email and tries the top 100 passwords to crack your account. There are other ways to tackle this, for example email OTP where a code (or link) is emailed to you before you login…

If they need a human to solve the puzzle, it is doing its job.

The problem is that somewhere along the way, we've decided that Robot⇒Evil and Human⇒Good and forgotten that evil humans exist.

Re: Tell HN: Airbnb just stole me 5 minutes of my time adding dices

#145

Post by dorchadas »

wink wrote: post #120
dorchadas wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their value-to-money is better because the externalize all the cost to the local community where they remove supply and up the rent for what supply is left.

The problem I see is that for certain trips a Hotel is simply bad. My last one was a Chaos Communication Congress where I knew I'd be in my room exactly 6h-8h per night for like 4 days. All I really need is a bed and a shower. In the end I chose a hostel for that but if I don't use 90% of the amenities of the hotel (not even storing my luggage there), why would I pay that high amount? Maybe it's too situational, mayb…

> For example sharing a flat with 6 people is sometimes half the cost of 3-4 hotel rooms (depending on how you can split)

And, again, this is the whole problem. Because that's a flat that could have gone to someone who actually lives and works in the local area, not a tourist. It's cheaper because it externalizes that cost.

I'm fine with hostels too, I see no problem with people choosing them. I'm not fine with converting residential homes into unlicensed hotels . It destroys the local community, and drives up prices for all the other people who are left trying to live there, and further feeds housing crises.

Re: Tell HN: Airbnb just stole me 5 minutes of my time adding dices

#146

Post by aembleton »

robin_reala wrote: post #74
Cthulhu_ wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's the ironic part, machines are able to solve these just fine so they defeat the purpose entirely. I wonder, does recaptcha work with your google account? Because at some point a lot of people will end up doing some kind of identity verification on there. But I think Google and co can make a reasonable assertion about being human by looking at activity across said Google account - location, emails, documents, et…

Yes, it does. Which means that people like me who block Google domains outside of designated sandboxes have a flipping awful time with ReCAPTCHA.

That's why I've added the following rule to allow recaptcha.

  @@||google.com/recaptcha/\*$script

Re: Tell HN: Airbnb just stole me 5 minutes of my time adding dices

#148

Post by nisegami »

cambaceres wrote: post #112
BiteCode_dev wrote: post #102

Airbnb has been very human hostile since the beginning. The first time I had to create an account, they required that I connect with a google account with access to all my contacts. Then ask me to make a video of myself. I didn't create the account and booked an hotel. Now they are less aggressive with their new procedures, but still, you can see that the people behind it see technical solutions way before they perce…

Sorry for sounding like a cynical right-winger but I'm sure people prefer to share toilets with other people instead of sleeping in the streets. In my country there are very regid regulations on what standard apartments has to fulfill, which has the consequence that not enough apartments are built that can be afforded by poor people.

I've long since suspected that a small part of the housing crises in the developed world is due to the high minimum standards for apartments and housing.

Re: Tell HN: Airbnb just stole me 5 minutes of my time adding dices

#149

Post by dorchadas »

imiric wrote: post #128
jb1991 wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve been so turned off by the entire concept of AirBnB, ever since their practices ruined several cities I love with massive overtourism influence. Like so many tech companies, the influence has just gotten completely out of control in the modern world on a global scale.

Why would Airbnb be to blame for this? They're providing a market that fulfills demand for low cost or privately owned accommodations, competing directly with the established hotel industry. Not everyone wants or needs to stay in a hotel, and many people prefer the tourist experience facilitated by local hosts. Long-term rentals are also a convenient way to experience a location that doesn't involve complicated paper…

They're providing this market by removing housing from the local people, which drives them out and drives up prices for those who stay. This, in turn, forces all the inhabitants of a city out of it, thus ruining the character those inhabitants gave it. All so some tourist can 'live like a local', at the expense of the actual locals being able to live like a local.

And it's wholeheartedly AirBnB's fault and problem. Not to mention there's often new apartment blocks being built to act as de-facto hotels but having none of the regulations in place, which isn't quite competition at all.

Basically, tourists aren't locals, they should have a right to live like locals. Especially at the expense of the locals.

Re: Tell HN: Airbnb just stole me 5 minutes of my time adding dices

#150

Post by imiric »

jb1991 wrote: post #137
imiric wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would Airbnb be to blame for this? They're providing a market that fulfills demand for low cost or privately owned accommodations, competing directly with the established hotel industry. Not everyone wants or needs to stay in a hotel, and many people prefer the tourist experience facilitated by local hosts. Long-term rentals are also a convenient way to experience a location that doesn't involve complicated paper…

> Why would Airbnb be to blame for this? Because they have pushed back hard on cities’ attempts to regulate and enforce what is happening due to the influence of their service. They have no respect for what is happening in some places and how residents are impacted. Your argument is similar to saying that Facebook is not to blame for the spread of misinformation. Tech platforms create a new world and then want nothin…

But it really is up to governments to enforce regulations. Companies have no choice but to ultimately comply if they want to keep operating in those locations. E.g. see Uber.

This is not similar to Facebook, since "overtourism" is not as obviously harmful as misinformation. How would you even define it? It could be argued that it's another aspect of globalization which benefits the local economy, the travel industry and mixing of cultures.

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