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Impacts of lack of sleep

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Re: Impacts of lack of sleep

#141

Post by veidr »

mikenew wrote: post #15

I've struggled with sleep for as long as I can remember. I have improved it considerably in the past year (still not perfect). Out of the dozens upon dozens of things I've tried, here's what I think made the most difference, in order of importance. 1. Very consistent bedtime and wake up time. +/- 30 minutes, but ideally less. Obviously if you struggle with sleep you can't count on falling asleep at the same time, but…

I also significantly improved my sleep with this exact same list (plus fasted cardio every morning and progressive weight lifting 3x/week).

Re: Impacts of lack of sleep

#142

Post by bubblecheck »

This is my sixth night being 100% homeless (on the streets with no vehicle, no private place to go). Sleep for the past five nights has ranged from non-existent to a few nodding hours in long sleeves laying down in various public places.

Compared to a week ago, I finally started to notice cognitive decline today. My words don't come out as smoothly, and I have gaps in thoughts.

Frankly, it's nothing like it was seven years ago after a bad break-up. That time, I got maybe 2-7 hours of sleep a week for a solid two months or so. It is an awful feeling being wide awake, unable to sleep at all, yet: dead tired, suicidal in a persistent 24hr a day drawing-towards-death sense, utterly afraid and unable to actually follow through.

It's odd to me that my situation then was far, far better than it is now. Sleep these past five homeless evenings with a ruined life -- even missing a few nights and only catching a few hours these past few -- are far better than those restless post-breakup nights seven years ago.

My life fell apart since seven years ago in numerous ways. Programming and participation in technology, generally, for me is completely dead and has been for years now. Perhaps the extended sleep deprivation removed any remaining desire to live. I've certainly been dead inside since then, moreso than in the past.

Still unable to finish suicide. The desire doesn't go away, ever. The terrifying fear of death, however, seems unlikely to ever dissipate, so actually completing suicide seems increasingly unlikely as the decades pass. This has been an ongoing desire since grade school.

I am still awaiting the big sleep. It can't come soon enough.

Re: Impacts of lack of sleep

#143

Post by flobosg »

xattt wrote: post #116
mettamage wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A couple of things worked on there for me as well, but the biggest one for me personally is 0.3mg of melatonin I started with 3mg, way too much, went to 1.5mg, still too much. Then did 0.7mg, that was fine but still some small side effects. Then 0.4mg that was fine. Then 0.2mg, that didn't work. Then I did 0.3mg and it seemed to be the sweet spot. I can just barely perceive it working and it is just enough to make me…

Most melatonin tablets are available in 3 mg formulation. What sort of microtome are you using for dosing?

In Germany melatonin capsules come usually in 1 mg doses or even 0.5 mg ones.

Re: Impacts of lack of sleep

#144

Post by ksec »

sofixa wrote: post #121
mikenew wrote: post #15

I've struggled with sleep for as long as I can remember. I have improved it considerably in the past year (still not perfect). Out of the dozens upon dozens of things I've tried, here's what I think made the most difference, in order of importance. 1. Very consistent bedtime and wake up time. +/- 30 minutes, but ideally less. Obviously if you struggle with sleep you can't count on falling asleep at the same time, but…

> Breathe through your nose. It can be hard at first but it gets easier over time I'm stumped here. Isn't that the normal way to breathe? Why would it be hard, unless you have some medical condition like sleep apnea, which requires treatment in itself?

Allergies. It is very very rare I can breath through my nose. Really wish I could because life is so much better when it does. I have been told surgical operation only works for about 10 years before it comes back. And no long term medication seems to be able to deal with it without some side effect.

Re: Impacts of lack of sleep

#145

Post by drec »

Hi, I recently launched an app to help you get better sleep through cognitive behavioural therapy for insomnia (CBT-i), which is the first line of treatment recommended by the American Academy of Sleep Medicine. The program is designed in collaboration with experts from Harvard Medical school. We are running a promotion at the moment, and lifetime access cost only $19.99 (with a 90 day money back guarantee, no questions ask). Check us out at https://slumber.one/offer

Re: Impacts of lack of sleep

#146

Post by watwut »

brimble wrote: post #11
WilTimSon wrote: post #4

I'm not sure how much this will do to change anyone. Sure, it's bluntly stated but, well, most people realize quite well that lack of sleep is awful and dangerous. People don't usually do it because they want to do it. Long hours at work, deadlines, stress, occasional bout of Netflix addiction. Out of all of those, there's only one that's easy to resolve and I'd wager that Netflix isn't usually the biggest contributo…

Imagine a medieval king who decided their castle should be lit up like day at nighttime, hundreds of candles in mirror-walled rooms, 365 days a year, and also that the entire castle save only the bed chamber would host the finest entertainers and all the most interesting friends and strangers in the world, party games and amusements in a hundred palace rooms, and a mage who could show the king any wonder of the world…

> I'd encourage everyone to try candle-only lighting after sundown

That means dark from before 17:00 to 8:00 and that is just too much. I can barely fit work into that.

Re: Impacts of lack of sleep

#147

Post by stuffuru »

My arch nemesis when it comes to sleep is obstructive sleep apnea. I have some soft tissue redundancies (long uvula and turbinate hypertrophy) as well as skeletal deficiencies (recessed jaw and narrow nasal cavity), and I had to have multiple surgeries in addition to PAP therapy to get reasonable (but not great) sleep. When I first started having unrefreshing sleep a couple of years ago, I tried everything under the sun when it comes to sleep hygiene (which helped a bit), but there comes a point when you really need medical interventions.

Re: Impacts of lack of sleep

#148

Post by vkk8 »

mettamage wrote: post #33
mikenew wrote: post #15

I've struggled with sleep for as long as I can remember. I have improved it considerably in the past year (still not perfect). Out of the dozens upon dozens of things I've tried, here's what I think made the most difference, in order of importance. 1. Very consistent bedtime and wake up time. +/- 30 minutes, but ideally less. Obviously if you struggle with sleep you can't count on falling asleep at the same time, but…

A couple of things worked on there for me as well, but the biggest one for me personally is 0.3mg of melatonin I started with 3mg, way too much, went to 1.5mg, still too much. Then did 0.7mg, that was fine but still some small side effects. Then 0.4mg that was fine. Then 0.2mg, that didn't work. Then I did 0.3mg and it seemed to be the sweet spot. I can just barely perceive it working and it is just enough to make me…

According to Scott Alexander's review (https://slatestarcodex.com/2018/07/10/melatonin-much-more-th...), 0.3mg is the correct dosage for melatonin and higher doses might do more harm than good. I think you have accidentally replicated some of the melatonin research on yourself.

I personally wouldn't want to use melatonin all the time. Relying on a drug to keep my circadian rhythm going seems fragile and scary.

Re: Impacts of lack of sleep

#149

Post by dentalperson »

FabHK wrote: post #67

Is this scientific consensus? I remember the Matthew Walker book (Why We Sleep) was heavily criticised. For example this article + discussion: https://guzey.com/books/why-we-sleep/ https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26684519 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21546850 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22419958

These points and the Guzey essay were discussed in depth in Science Fictions by Stuart Ritchie, which features examples of negligence and fraud in science. Having read and enjoyed the message in Why We Sleep, my first reaction before reading based on the length of the essay was that the motivation was axe-grindy, but the further I read the more it made sense and the more egregious Walker's claims seemed. The lack of a response from Walker is another serious concern (especially after Andrew Gelman highlights this). It seems that he is trying to avoid a Streisand Effect by ignoring it completely. If that is the case, Walker's strategy seems to be working because on the comments on new threads like this, many mention mention Walker but seem unaware of the criticisms.

Re: Impacts of lack of sleep

#150

Post by f1refly »

toast0 wrote: post #128
sofixa wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Breathe through your nose. It can be hard at first but it gets easier over time I'm stumped here. Isn't that the normal way to breathe? Why would it be hard, unless you have some medical condition like sleep apnea, which requires treatment in itself?

I have to actively try to breathe through my nose, it's often congested (having a pet despite allergies doesn't help), and it's just simpler to breathe through my mouth, cause that just works. Medical interventions are possible, but I'm not thrilled with the side effects of the medicines I've tried, and surgery has some really awful tail risks, so there's that. I was recently recomended to try B1 (thiamine) supplimen…

Why would you get a pet when you're allergic?
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