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The medieval habit of ‘two sleeps’

bbc.com

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Re: The medieval habit of ‘two sleeps’

#141

Post by zarzavat »

aparticulate wrote: post #113
Taywee wrote: post #111

I find it frustrating that the explanation of the schedule switches from a 24-hour clock to apparently a 12-hour clock without AM or PM designation > From as early as 21:00 to 23:00, those fortunate enough to afford them would begin flopping onto mattresses...A couple of hours later, people would begin rousing from this initial slumber. The night-time wakefulness usually lasted from around 11:00 to about 01:00

My theory— In the UK, 24-hour is used much more in writing than in other parts of the anglosphere, but no Brit uses 24-hour in speech. I reckon the typo occurs when people have to convert from their "speaking" brain to their "writing" brain.

That and because British people are used to thinking in both systems and implicitly converting between them, they may not even notice the inconsistency. Whereas for Americans who are used to the 12 hour system, the discrepancy sticks out much more strongly.

Re: The medieval habit of ‘two sleeps’

#142

Post by bloak »

paganel wrote: post #135
hatmatrix wrote: post #103

"Despite near-constant headlines about the prevalence of sleep problems, Ekirch has previously argued that, in some ways, the 21st Century is a golden age for sleep – a time when most of us no longer have to worry about being murdered in our beds, freezing to death, or flicking off lice, when we can slumber without pain, the threat of fire, or having strangers snuggled up next to us." What a wonderful time we live in…

Not sure if your comment was partially made as a joke or not but I can certainly attest that having to wake up at 4 or 5 in the morning because of lice is not ideal. My parents live in the (Eastern-European) countryside and because of the environment (basically all sorts of animals living around the house) they started having lice since 2-3 years, I think. You eventually get used to them, one of the keys is to tuck (…

Are you really talking about lice, or do you mean bedbugs?

If you mean lice, do you mean head lice, body lice, or pubic lice?

Re: The medieval habit of ‘two sleeps’

#143

Post by [deleted] »

bloak wrote: post #142
paganel wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure if your comment was partially made as a joke or not but I can certainly attest that having to wake up at 4 or 5 in the morning because of lice is not ideal. My parents live in the (Eastern-European) countryside and because of the environment (basically all sorts of animals living around the house) they started having lice since 2-3 years, I think. You eventually get used to them, one of the keys is to tuck (…

Are you really talking about lice, or do you mean bedbugs? If you mean lice, do you mean head lice, body lice, or pubic lice?

[deleted]

Re: The medieval habit of ‘two sleeps’

#144

Post by gspr »

SimplyUnknown wrote: post #140
hatmatrix wrote: post #103

"Despite near-constant headlines about the prevalence of sleep problems, Ekirch has previously argued that, in some ways, the 21st Century is a golden age for sleep – a time when most of us no longer have to worry about being murdered in our beds, freezing to death, or flicking off lice, when we can slumber without pain, the threat of fire, or having strangers snuggled up next to us." What a wonderful time we live in…

Conditions may apply. If you're homeless or living in a country with ongoing war, disease or hunger the likelihood that you have to worry about any of these things goes up dramatically.

Of course. But the fact that the norm is that one doesn't have to worry about these things still is a huge improvement.

Re: The medieval habit of ‘two sleeps’

#145

Post by Cthulhu_ »

gspr wrote: post #144
SimplyUnknown wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Conditions may apply. If you're homeless or living in a country with ongoing war, disease or hunger the likelihood that you have to worry about any of these things goes up dramatically.

Of course. But the fact that the norm is that one doesn't have to worry about these things still is a huge improvement.

Indeed, and since you already called it the norm, we need to ensure that everybody gets to live that way.

Re: The medieval habit of ‘two sleeps’

#146

Post by Cthulhu_ »

lopis wrote: post #138
m_eiman wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's a nice graphic showing a baby's sleep pattern during the first 15 weeks: http://www.eiman.tv/misc/somnrytm.jpg Since the text is in Swedish, here's roughly what it says: Every row is a day, black is sleep, white is awake.

Oh wow. Babies sleep a lot.

I'm jealous, lol

Re: The medieval habit of ‘two sleeps’

#147

Post by folli »

lopis wrote: post #138
m_eiman wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's a nice graphic showing a baby's sleep pattern during the first 15 weeks: http://www.eiman.tv/misc/somnrytm.jpg Since the text is in Swedish, here's roughly what it says: Every row is a day, black is sleep, white is awake.

Oh wow. Babies sleep a lot.

Trouble is, they also wake up a lot.

Re: The medieval habit of ‘two sleeps’

#148

Post by necovek »

It's so weird that all this research and discussion never once mentions daylight length difference between summer and winter in parts of the world far out of the equatorial belt.

The difference is between almost 16h of night time (depending on your definition, of course, since some light will be there even if Sun is not out) in late December and 8h of night time in late June at 45 degrees of latitude.

I wouldn't be surprised if sleeping twice during the night was more frequent during winter time in Europe.

Still, ever since fire was introduced into houses, there was an artificial light source as well.

Re: The medieval habit of ‘two sleeps’

#149

Post by necovek »

hatmatrix wrote: post #103

"Despite near-constant headlines about the prevalence of sleep problems, Ekirch has previously argued that, in some ways, the 21st Century is a golden age for sleep – a time when most of us no longer have to worry about being murdered in our beds, freezing to death, or flicking off lice, when we can slumber without pain, the threat of fire, or having strangers snuggled up next to us." What a wonderful time we live in…

This conclusion immediately jumped out at me: why not strive for the benefits of both?

This seems to just be an attempt to keep critics at bay.

Re: The medieval habit of ‘two sleeps’

#150

Post by necovek »

Cthulhu_ wrote: post #145
gspr wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course. But the fact that the norm is that one doesn't have to worry about these things still is a huge improvement.

Indeed, and since you already called it the norm, we need to ensure that everybody gets to live that way.

A norm does not make it a minimum baseline: a norm is something that's prevalent or average.

Not disagreeing with your desire to make that the baseline, just with the terminology :)

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