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Steps Towards Happiness (2015)

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Re: Steps Towards Happiness (2015)

#141

Post by lexapro »

pdimitar wrote: post #127
go_elmo wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

honestly, its just our fears stopping us. As a programmer you earn enough in 1-5 years to live like a god in parts of the world. To be happy one can also start farming and have a small garden somewhere on this planet, live a decent life and be happy. Its pure fear stopping us.

That skips way too many details. I am 41 and I was never able to save a money. Partially because I was stupid, absolutely, but I also came to realize how much we are sheep-herded into consumerism. And many times we don't have a choice. People's fridges, ovens, air conditioners, dish washers, vacuum cleaners, smartphones etc., nowadays seem to start breaking like clockwork literal weeks to months after the warranty ex…

Many programmers can save >50% of their net income. I realize that this is not possible in every part of the world or in every situation, but if anyone is stable financially, it's probably us.

Re: Steps Towards Happiness (2015)

#142

Post by wing-_-nuts »

UncleOxidant wrote: post #90
pdimitar wrote: post #37

I don't disagree with the article in principle, but to me it seems that us the modern people are pressured much harder than previous generations. At 41 y/o I have arrived at most of the same wisdom but I can't see how and where can I implement it. As others commenters said, I wish I could take a pay cut and work on things I love more than my current job. I absolutely can't afford it; not because I can't take the inco…

> but to me it seems that us the modern people are pressured much harder than previous generations. I don't think this is even close to true. In fact we've got it pretty soft compared to many earlier eras. Think about having to wake up prior to daybreak to feed the animals, milk the cows, start fires for cooking, heating (a lot of wood chopping), etc. Having to haul drinking water. Scratching out a subsistence living…

Happiness and satisfaction are relative to prior experience. I started out my adult life below the poverty line on disability, and small things like fresh fruit and veg or owning my home or car feel like lavish luxuries to me. Someone who was raised with a silver spoon would consider my spartan lifestyle miserly.

Re: Steps Towards Happiness (2015)

#143

Post by volkk »

vlunkr wrote: post #103
pdimitar wrote: post #37

I don't disagree with the article in principle, but to me it seems that us the modern people are pressured much harder than previous generations. At 41 y/o I have arrived at most of the same wisdom but I can't see how and where can I implement it. As others commenters said, I wish I could take a pay cut and work on things I love more than my current job. I absolutely can't afford it; not because I can't take the inco…

I think this attitude, which is becoming increasingly prevalent on the internet, is probably causing tons of unnecessary unhappiness. How many periods in history have there been where the average person was comfortable taking a pay cut? Even if there was such a period, it would have been true only for a privileged subset of the population.

also hindsight is always 20/20, but if you don't seek to be happier now and this looming economic depression that might happen doesn't happen for another 10-15 years, then you've just spent that much time being unhappy. but on the other hand, if you quit your job now and it happens a month from now then you'd be kicking yourself hard.

so the only solution is to just make a damn decision, and have a plan for either scenario. trying to time unforeseen black swan events, or economic factors seem to be a losing game. if it wasn't, we'd all be billionaires.

Re: Steps Towards Happiness (2015)

#144

Post by lexapro »

lukebuehler wrote: post #28
drclau wrote: post #14

Every time I hear or read about happiness, I remember this quote from Thomas Metzinger. I hope you’ll find it useful, too: “Evolution as such is not a process to be glorified: It is blind, driven by chance and not by insight. It is merciless and sacrifices individuals. It invented the reward system in the brain; it invented positive and negative feelings to motivate our behavior; it placed us on a hedonic treadmill t…

Well, if you want a really reductionist view of happiness, which also happens to be largely true, you could say: have children.

There are many studies on this; parents are less happy than non‑parents on average.

Re: Steps Towards Happiness (2015)

#145

Post by golemiprague »

groby_b wrote: post #133
pdimitar wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cherry picking makes no argument any favours. :P I agree on WW2, sure, but after WW2? I've spoken with 30+ elders and they all unanimously agree that life in general was much, much better than today. Mostly in terms of upwards social mobility. An insane amount of very regular bank tellers could afford house, two apartments and 2-3 cars. And to put 3 kids in an university. Nowadays that's a very questionable endeavour…

I'd strongly suggest looking for supporting data. If you talk to people, you will inevitably hear that "the good old times" were better than what we have. In the 1950s, the average house was still ~3 years of average income. Cars were about 9 months of income. So the "regular bank teller" with a house, 2 apartments, and 3 cars... there's something missing in the story. Let's not even get into the fact that life was s…

Is it so much better for black people these days to grow up without a dad in some crappy neighbourhood with gun shots every weekend comparing to growing up in a family in a peaceful neighbourhood in the 50'? I am not so sure and I don't see so much intermixing with the rest of the American society, blacks still interact mainly among themselves so it is not that different from the times when this kind of segregation was institutionalised. Women also don't seem to be that thrilled from their current situation, who said being another HR manager is better than being a housewife? From the amount of complains you hear about how hard it is to be black or a woman these days it seems like they are much less happy, at least subjectively.

Re: Steps Towards Happiness (2015)

#146

Post by sg47 »

TimPC wrote: post #69
pdimitar wrote: post #37

I don't disagree with the article in principle, but to me it seems that us the modern people are pressured much harder than previous generations. At 41 y/o I have arrived at most of the same wisdom but I can't see how and where can I implement it. As others commenters said, I wish I could take a pay cut and work on things I love more than my current job. I absolutely can't afford it; not because I can't take the inco…

Financially sure we face more pressure. But let’s be honest that modern society is practically a utopia compared to being drafted into WW2 and facing carnage and death.

With WW2, people had a clear goal to look forward to. Ending the war. Today, people are drifting aimlessly and just go through life which causes more dissatisfaction than being in the middle of a war.

Re: Steps Towards Happiness (2015)

#147

Post by wing-_-nuts »

mahogany wrote: post #136
wing-_-nuts wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Alcohol is a poison that offers short term fun for long term sadness and pain. Alcohol in excess ? Certainly, but I don't buy the idea that alcohol in moderation is harmful. There have, of course, been studies that draw negative conclusions about alcohol, but they either commingle societal effects or discount the cardiovascular benefits. TLDR: Alcohol in moderation is fine. Just don't drink to excess. Nearly all the…

The J-shaped curves that you mention might be due to flaws in study design. In particular, the category of alcohol-abstainers includes people who are abstaining for health-related reasons (for example, former heavy drinkers!), so you would expect this to inflate the rate of negative impacts for abstainers. When these biases are controlled for, the benefits of alcohol consumption -- in any quantity -- largely disappea…

Yeah, the 'sick quitter' problem is pretty tricky, but even if you look at studies that only consider cancer rates, yes, the rates rise with consumption, but things really only explode exponentially past a certain point that is way higher than anyone should be drinking.

Personally, I typically limit myself to a 6 pack a week. I think even a 12 pack a week wouldn't do much harm, and if we're talking about happiness, having a beer with friends certainly does add to that. I am perfectly willing to accept a small increased risk for that. None of us are making it out of this life alive.

Re: Steps Towards Happiness (2015)

#148

Post by wing-_-nuts »

ketzo wrote: post #132
wing-_-nuts wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Alcohol is a poison that offers short term fun for long term sadness and pain. Alcohol in excess ? Certainly, but I don't buy the idea that alcohol in moderation is harmful. There have, of course, been studies that draw negative conclusions about alcohol, but they either commingle societal effects or discount the cardiovascular benefits. TLDR: Alcohol in moderation is fine. Just don't drink to excess. Nearly all the…

I mean, this is purely anecdotal, but if I drink two or three glasses of wine in a night, I get noticeably worse sleep quality than if I drink nothing. There are long-term effects associated with heavy drinking, but there are also short-term negative effects (for some people) associated with pretty much any alcohol consumption at all. Headaches, acid reflux, etc.

Yep, some people are especially sensitive to alcohol, and it does absolutely trash one's rem sleep. This is why I typically only drink on the weekends, limit consumption, and try not to drink after 4-5pm.

Re: Steps Towards Happiness (2015)

#149

Post by burntoutfire »

sg47 wrote: post #146
TimPC wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Financially sure we face more pressure. But let’s be honest that modern society is practically a utopia compared to being drafted into WW2 and facing carnage and death.

With WW2, people had a clear goal to look forward to. Ending the war. Today, people are drifting aimlessly and just go through life which causes more dissatisfaction than being in the middle of a war.

For people in occupied countries (Europe and elsewhere), the goal was to merely survive the war and deal with the fallout (death of relatives, destruction of property). Even with drafts, US was a paradise on earth during 1939-1945 compared to much of the world.

Re: Steps Towards Happiness (2015)

#150

Post by j4hdufd8 »

lukebuehler wrote: post #38
j4hdufd8 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What does that mean?

The quote in the parent comment says that the whole hedonic machinery within us is a result of natural selection, of which conscious happiness is just a side effect. Then why not just go ahead and do what that machinery drives you do to: go and have offspring. Chances are that this is the nexus where most happiness can be found.

Wow, that... makes a lot of sense. It's one of those things I already knew intuitively but couldn't formalize why.
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