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Faced with soaring Ds and Fs, schools are ditching the old way of grading

latimes.com

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Re: Faced with soaring Ds and Fs, schools are ditching the old way of grading

#141

Post by pcmoney »

stjohnswarts wrote: post #133
uejfiweun wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How on earth do we de-escalate from here? I feel that in the US it is impossible to summon the political willpower to make it HARDER to graduate HS or go to college, even if these things would make society better off. My personal opinion is that the government should get out of education, just lower our taxes and let the free market handle the rest. Never gonna happen, however.

Quoted post unavailable.

Even if that were true, that half would still mop the floor intellectually with the type of fool that would write a statement like the one above.

Re: Faced with soaring Ds and Fs, schools are ditching the old way of grading

#142

Post by _AzMoo »

jim-jim-jim wrote: post #121
ipaddr wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would paying more for teachers fix the issue? The best teachers will still prefer private school because kids are more displined. You end up paying more for the same or worse now you attract a new group who are in it for the money. Education starts at home and without a learning culture with displine these children are setup to fail.

Anecdotal, but during my time as a teacher, the one variable that seemed to govern the success/failure of students was home life—especially whether or not the child had two loving parents. Poverty seems to be the common denominator in those unstable households. I think a broad and robust approach to our collective welfare can address the issue far better than "more money to education!" can.

It's not just anecdotal.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S02765...

Just one example of many.

Everybody's talking about the problems with schools, but the issue is the enormous gap in economic inequality that is just growing larger and larger. Parents who have to work 2-3 jobs to support their families don't have the time or energy to devote to supporting their children in their academic lives.

Re: Faced with soaring Ds and Fs, schools are ditching the old way of grading

#143

Post by pcmoney »

SavantIdiot wrote: post #93

Glad to see school systems addressing the systemic inequities that have become visible due to the pandemic. There are other ways to grade. The point system has always been lazy, about as effective at predicting competence and success as standardized testing. What really predicts success is how rich your parents are. Sure there are rich fuckups, but not having to take care of parents or younger siblings while living o…

No it is fear I’ll be on the operating table with a surgeon who has been trained to think that if he botches something there is a do over.

Re: Faced with soaring Ds and Fs, schools are ditching the old way of grading

#144

Post by visarga »

throwaway23451 wrote: post #5

I’m sure every generation feels like the next is going to turn the world to hell… but what the hell? I find it absolutely bonkers that gifted classes, math, homework and objective performance assessments are suddenly under fire as instruments perpetuating inequality. Does our education system leave much to be desired? Absolutely! Let’s pay teachers more and improve access to quality education for all students, not co…

> assessments are suddenly under fire as instruments perpetuating inequality

But we all want and need the other people to be assessed. When we go to the doctor, we want to know they competed for and earned the right to be in that position. A lack of high standards would hurt every identity group. For example, COVID won't avoid or forgive people who are in discriminated groups, or be any easier to heal by a doctor in this group - nature doesn't care.

Re: Faced with soaring Ds and Fs, schools are ditching the old way of grading

#145

Post by vkou »

mek6800d2 wrote: post #72
throwaway23451 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s unfortunate. Twenty years ago I attended high school in a working class suburb. I was fortunate to get selected into a gifted program and had teachers who challenged me to work hard and overcome my surrounding. Changed my life and inspired a career as a data scientist and entrepreneur. I hope the younger generation can have the benefit of adults who care enough about them to challenge them to succeed, because…

Yes, the younger generation will not be prepared for the meritocracy that awaits them out in the real world.

Is this a joke? Because while the real world is not graded on the curve, it is the very opposite of a meritocracy.

Re: Faced with soaring Ds and Fs, schools are ditching the old way of grading

#146

Post by crehn »

bodhiandpysics1 wrote: post #14
zem wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the point of school is to give you a basic educational foundation, not to prepare you for the workplace

I agree! Also "prepare for the workplace" is meaningless. There are many many different kinds of workplaces!

Regardless of the "workplace", I think what it really means is an aptitude to be productive despite ambiguity and less-than-ideal conditions. Those skills apply everywhere.

Re: Faced with soaring Ds and Fs, schools are ditching the old way of grading

#148

Post by mjevans »

bsder wrote: post #90
uejfiweun wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How on earth do we de-escalate from here? I feel that in the US it is impossible to summon the political willpower to make it HARDER to graduate HS or go to college, even if these things would make society better off. My personal opinion is that the government should get out of education, just lower our taxes and let the free market handle the rest. Never gonna happen, however.

> How on earth do we de-escalate from here? The SAT provides a hard deadline which prevents you from de-escalating high school. College provides a soft deadline which prevents you from de-escalating as getting a degree before you run out of money is an employment filter. You have to remove college as an employment filter in order to de-escalate the whole thing.

College is a filter because you don't get it for free * (usually) and to pass must show up on time and do the work.

High school _could_ become such a filter if a national standard were developed and _enforced_. Education shouldn't stop until that is met or someone ends up on mental disability status. More help still should be provided if the external environment isn't conducive to success.

Such a basic qualifying education should be a human right, further the right of anything which can think. Graduation from that filter could be a requirement to being a productive and full member of society. I _still_ disagree, that under the exact circumstances outlined above, where the right to that education and the fulfillment of it's mandate are a per-requisite, in that set of circumstances graduating could be a requirement to vote. Proof that someone is a functioning member of society (because otherwise they'd be a pre-adult protected class of society).

Re: Faced with soaring Ds and Fs, schools are ditching the old way of grading

#149

Post by askafriend »

Lhiw wrote: post #132
laserbeam wrote: post #101

I was really hoping this is a decent article about what some teacher or school did about the problem. It starts like that but then it goes kablookie... So, a certain Joshua Moreno is fed up with the system and did something about that, 2 paragraphs. GREAT. Then the rest of the entire article is about institutionalized racism and how the current system fails us. At no point do we get a good example about what mr Moren…

Why do you have to agree there is institutional racism in schools to think this is garbage writing? Worried you'll get called a racist for suggesting an anti racist is wrong? Actually on topic though, Asia is laughing at us. Removing homework and grading? Because "racism"? You shouldn't be penalizing well off people (white or not) with worse schooling because some lower class students (black or not) dont have enough…

They mention that because it emphasizes their other point.

It's the equivalent of "I'm a vegetarian but even I drool at the thought of bacon". You don't have to mention that you're vegetarian....it's there because it places extra emphasis on how appealing bacon can be.

sigh did I really to break it down like that

Re: Faced with soaring Ds and Fs, schools are ditching the old way of grading

#150

Post by wwilim »

Lhiw wrote: post #132
laserbeam wrote: post #101

I was really hoping this is a decent article about what some teacher or school did about the problem. It starts like that but then it goes kablookie... So, a certain Joshua Moreno is fed up with the system and did something about that, 2 paragraphs. GREAT. Then the rest of the entire article is about institutionalized racism and how the current system fails us. At no point do we get a good example about what mr Moren…

Why do you have to agree there is institutional racism in schools to think this is garbage writing? Worried you'll get called a racist for suggesting an anti racist is wrong? Actually on topic though, Asia is laughing at us. Removing homework and grading? Because "racism"? You shouldn't be penalizing well off people (white or not) with worse schooling because some lower class students (black or not) dont have enough…

How is this penalizing well-off students? By making it harder to automatically get ahead in education just because your poor classmates are sliding off the slippery slope of a negative feedback loop? I wouldn't call it penalizing.
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