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Firefighters say they’re swamped by calls for routine care from senior homes

oregonlive.com

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Re: Firefighters say they’re swamped by calls for routine care from senior homes

#141

Post by threatofrain »

titanomachy wrote: post #60
mberning wrote: post #43

Our medical system is completely screwed up from a capacity standpoint. I was sick a few weeks ago and called my primary care doc. No appointments for a week. Do an online appointment which is useless and they say I need to be seen. Go to urgent care. 4 hour wait. I figured that was my best option so toughed it out. During my time waiting I saw multiple people come in, talk to the receptionist, and leave in tears whe…

Wow, where is this? Doesn’t match my experience at all (US west coast).

LA is like this, but maybe worse.

Re: Firefighters say they’re swamped by calls for routine care from senior homes

#142

Post by conk »

throwawayboise wrote: post #102
pmorici wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Elderly people should live with their families." Spoken with the confidence of someone who has never had to care for an elderly relative who was in both mental and physical decline. In any case it is a deeply personal decision without a definitive right or wrong answer. After seeing my Aunt try to care for my grandmother for years only for it to negatively effect their relationship because of her dementia I wouldn't…

There are probably well-run exceptions but in my experience senior communities are mostly about extracting all the wealth and insurance payments they can get from their residents before they die. You think it's hard taking care of your aging parents? They took care of you when you were a helpless, shitting, crying, little ball of flesh.

A baby can’t turn the stove on and burn down the house or attempt to drive a car and kill someone. Some forms of mental decline require specialized care facilities for the safety of both the elderly and their family members.

Re: Firefighters say they’re swamped by calls for routine care from senior homes

#143

Post by cratermoon »

fighterpilot wrote: post #140
cratermoon wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An individual living in an isolated rural community wanting a chat is almost entirely unlike a for-profit corporation running a group home calling a paramedic to change someone's bandages because they are cutting costs by not hiring sufficient staff.

"because they are cutting costs by not hiring sufficient staff." Or because the fire department has failed to implement something as basic as a call-out fee for frivolous calls. Of course a service is going to get over-subscribed and abused if the price for it is way too low. Both individuals and corporations will do that because it follows from the incentives provided to them. Lonely old people are going to sit on a…

> call-out fee for frivolous calls

Sounds like a typical neoliberal "free market" non-solution.

Re: Firefighters say they’re swamped by calls for routine care from senior homes

#144

Post by dls2016 »

GaryTang wrote: post #134
dls2016 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You know there are a lot of places in the US with volunteer fire departments, right?

To volunteer implies you are already well off enough to have housing and food, thus have the luxury of being able to donate your time to volunteering.

Be my guest, go to a small town fire hall and see how “well off” the volunteers are compared to the median HN poster.

Re: Firefighters say they’re swamped by calls for routine care from senior homes

#145

Post by stirlo »

falcolas wrote: post #48
john_yaya wrote: post #15

Senior homes and assisted living centers are a national disgrace. They are entirely about profit maximization (what business isn’t?), and as such hire people at the exact minimum and have well over 100% yearly turnover. The staff commonly steal from residents, and the management do not care. They’d rather retain a larcenous pig who barely executes her duties than have to go back and scrape the barrel for a replacemen…

> Elderly people should live with their families. No. It’s an unreasonable burden to expect families, which are barely holding themselves together in this wonderful world of mandatory-two-income-households we’ve built, to take on not only their adult children who can’t afford to rent or buy their own homes, but also the extensive and expensive care of their elders.

I don't support the GPs view that the elderly should live with their families.

I do however take issue with you suggesting this would be bad for financial reasons. Realistically assigning some of the wealth older people have built up to their families caring for them rather than for profit corporations would be a financial benefit.

The issue is expecting younger family members in the prime of their lives to put their life on hold to care for the elderly when this care can be required for decades (unlike infants).

Re: Firefighters say they’re swamped by calls for routine care from senior homes

#146

Post by fighterpilot »

cratermoon wrote: post #143
fighterpilot wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"because they are cutting costs by not hiring sufficient staff." Or because the fire department has failed to implement something as basic as a call-out fee for frivolous calls. Of course a service is going to get over-subscribed and abused if the price for it is way too low. Both individuals and corporations will do that because it follows from the incentives provided to them. Lonely old people are going to sit on a…

> call-out fee for frivolous calls Sounds like a typical neoliberal "free market" non-solution.

This snarky reply isn't a rebuttal of any substance. A frivolous call-out fee is a clear and simple solution. If you fix the price then the problem goes away because the incentive for the frivolous call-out no longer exists. It's cheaper for them to hire another staff member than rely on the fire department.

Re: Firefighters say they’re swamped by calls for routine care from senior homes

#147

Post by GaryTang »

dls2016 wrote: post #144
GaryTang wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To volunteer implies you are already well off enough to have housing and food, thus have the luxury of being able to donate your time to volunteering.

Be my guest, go to a small town fire hall and see how “well off” the volunteers are compared to the median HN poster.

I have been. Not one of them are forced to be firefighters. They volunteer

Re: Firefighters say they’re swamped by calls for routine care from senior homes

#148

Post by cepp »

cratermoon wrote: post #105
cepp wrote: post #57

Back when I worked at $HEALTHCARE_INUSRANCE_CO we were trying to solve this (more general problem) from the other side. We regularly saw routine calls for what could only be described as "loneliness". Our research lead us to find that a high percentage of elderly folks (50+) identified as lonely regardless of their living situation. [1] Looking deeper into claims data, we found a high percentage of these calls were i…

An individual living in an isolated rural community wanting a chat is almost entirely unlike a for-profit corporation running a group home calling a paramedic to change someone's bandages because they are cutting costs by not hiring sufficient staff.

For an insurance company, who'll burden the cost, they're the same problem. Different cause, but same problem.

Re: Firefighters say they’re swamped by calls for routine care from senior homes

#149

Post by WalterBright »

Swizec wrote: post #106
neither_color wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And in the rest of the non-nihilistic world those grandchildren would rather have one more year of grandma than any amount of money 15 years later. This whole discussion of letting seniors die to optimize economic potential is gross.

That probably depends a lot on the state of the grandma. Spry and lively full of great conversation and wonderful tales of old times? Yes! Barely able to remember her own name from dementia or in constant terrible pain from her life of labor on the farm finally catching up to her? Eh … The latter is especially difficult. I have a grandma in the family (not mine) who really just wants to die. Can’t even get out of bed…

Every day you can wake up, get out of bed and stand up is a beautiful day.

Re: Firefighters say they’re swamped by calls for routine care from senior homes

#150

Post by nyokodo »

falcolas wrote: post #48
john_yaya wrote: post #15

Senior homes and assisted living centers are a national disgrace. They are entirely about profit maximization (what business isn’t?), and as such hire people at the exact minimum and have well over 100% yearly turnover. The staff commonly steal from residents, and the management do not care. They’d rather retain a larcenous pig who barely executes her duties than have to go back and scrape the barrel for a replacemen…

> Elderly people should live with their families. No. It’s an unreasonable burden to expect families, which are barely holding themselves together in this wonderful world of mandatory-two-income-households we’ve built, to take on not only their adult children who can’t afford to rent or buy their own homes, but also the extensive and expensive care of their elders.

> the extensive and expensive care of their elders.

Granted cognitive decline and other conditions are extremely difficult to manage, however it’s remarkable how easy and cheap a disturbingly large chunk of elder care is. Just someone there to make sure elders take their meds on time, monitor their blood pressure, making sure they’re eating or go to the doctor if anything bothers them etc; all these tasks could be done in-home with family, or minimally trained healthcare workers. We could even pay families and healthcare workers handsomely and we’d still save massive amounts on the outrageous expense in elder quality-of-life and healthcare expenditure we pay because those simple interventions aren’t made.

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