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1password is considering a self-hosted option to store vaults

1password.community

141–150 of 228 posts

Re: 1password is considering a self-hosted option to store vaults

#142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don’t like the idea of storing opaque bits along with everyone else’s equally opaque bits? So long as the secret key to these bits is yours, not theirs, what’s the catch?

For a whole class of potential (if unlikely) situations, it shifts from me potentially being caught up in a mass hack, response to an overly broad warrant, etc to needing be targeted specifically. Passphrase compromised? If they're hosting, you know exactly where to go to access my passwords. If I'm hosting, I can tell you that I use 1Password and my master password and I'm still _relatively_ safe in that you don't e…

> Passphrase compromised? If they're hosting, you know exactly where to go to access my passwords. If I'm hosting, I can tell you that I use 1Password and my master password and I'm still _relatively_ safe in that you don't even know where to find a copy of my password database.

The above argument seems to turn out the same even for cloud-synced vaults.

If Dropbox suffered a massive hack, the malicious actor could take all the *.agilekeychain and *.opvault files stored there, brute force the master passwords locally, and have potentially complete control over some people's finances and online lives.

Re: 1password is considering a self-hosted option to store vaults

#144

I always assumed that they didn’t have the keys to unlock my vault, so even if something was compromised it is all encrypted with no way for them to access it. What is the advantage of self hosting?

TLDR; Big reason is policing is going to get a lot more invasive; however, I have found the very positive reflection that my in-house services are far more reliable.

I have the advantage that I am a programmer, so I can deal with a bit of reading install guides and arcane configuration. I was surprised to learn just how reliable things can be. Open Source tends to move forwards, so I don't have features taken from me. In recent memory, both 1Password and Fantastical have taken my features in the name of subscriptions. I installed ZigBee home automation with a Hubitat. It has never failed me. Internet and Wi-Fi can be down and things still work. The unreliable part is Google Nest (invalidates tokens every now and then) and Apple Siri (randomly can't do things at times). In short, I can automatically scan and OCR documents, have file services, movie and music, and more, and it all just works.

/rant mode enabled

It has become obvious to me that the law is quickly becoming snitch based. With so much information being hosted online, it's just too tempting a target to not use it for other purposes. Google and Facebook are just the leaders in where this is going. There is just no reason for law enforcement to not scan for dissonant behavior at some point, just as they roam the roads looking for violators. As more jobs become remote, the argument will be "the roads of the 21st century are on the Internet." Difference before is if you get pulled over on the road, you can log it. You know when and where it happened. You have evidence of the encounter. You can see what was used against you and who.

The new system you requires you to try to prove your innocence. You won't know when or where you were targeted. You are not allowed to inspect the software or see the matching hash information. You must open your phone to prove the file is innocent, at which is is legal for the police to capture data. Finally, it is NOT against the law for law enforcement to lie to you [1]. This utterly stacks the deck against you.

All of this could be avoided if at the time of the event you could record what happened and challenge it, because ultimately law enforcement is a money making scheme. Cops are the largest thieving group in America, so treat them like it[2]: a car alarm doesn't stop them, it's just means most thieves will choose an easier target. So, private services doesn't stop a cop, but following cloud events is a lot easier than trying to get into my house.

My sincere hope is that the cloud keeps them busy enough to stay far away from me.

[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_IZlrf8CiM4 [2] https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/11/23/cops-...

Re: 1password is considering a self-hosted option to store vaults

#145
post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How did you do that? Did you port license from an older 1Password, or is there some way to buy 1Password 7?

Not the parent poster, but this can be done from inside the app. They hid the link, but the purchase flow is still available from inside 1Password.

Thank you, I'll check it out.

Re: 1password is considering a self-hosted option to store vaults

#146
post #54
post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it is Electron, I don't think you can credibly call an entire Chromium instance a "very slim wrapper".

There's a chance it's using Tauri (rust) https://tauri.studio/en/ if it's truly not using Electron but a similar concept. However WASM builds in Electron would make more sense if they use the term Electron.

No, it's definitely regular Electron:

    % tar ztf 1password-latest.tar.gz | grep "chrome"
    1password-8.1.1.x64/chrome-sandbox
    1password-8.1.1.x64/chrome_100_percent.pak
    1password-8.1.1.x64/chrome_200_percent.pak

Re: 1password is considering a self-hosted option to store vaults

#147
post #84
post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tavis Ormandy (of Google Project Zero) has a pretty convincing post arguing that relying on browser extensions that modify the DOM (which includes [almost?] all password managers) is a bad idea: https://lock.cmpxchg8b.com/passmgrs.html (he recommends using your browser's built-in password manager, which isn't as convenient but is much more secure)

I only open the webui, log in, copy paste my usernames and passwords. I don't trust that my passwords are safe otherwise.

The clipboard is not exactly a secure channel. Browsers need to catch up to mobile and provide dedicated APIs for password managers to hook into so they don’t have to interact with the DOM.

Re: 1password is considering a self-hosted option to store vaults

#149
post #13

They made the standalone license almost impossible to find and get, forced a subscription on users, and made the password vault storage online for the subscriptions. Now this self-hosting survey comes as a surprise, and it would be of some relief if/when it’s implemented. I do wonder how the licensing and pricing will be handled though. Bitwarden officially allows self-hosting for the personal use tiers, but it seems…

> Is there any password management application out there that makes sharing passwords or password vaults easy but is also free? For members of a relatively well-paid profession earning good wages from creating software, I wonder if the reluctance to support others earning money for quality work isn’t some form of cognitive dissonance. // Pre-emptive “edit” before this comment has replies: Folks post a lot of argument…

There is a lot of merit to free software and open spurce spftware but in this or other cyber security cases, I would prefer a paid option that makes it clear where the devs are getting thrir money from. If it is free, than the user is the product.

Re: 1password is considering a self-hosted option to store vaults

#150
post #80

Semi-related: this survey was announced alongside 1Password 8 for Windows early access. Apparently 1Password 8 for Windows uses Electron and there was some discussion about AgileBits wanting to move to the same architecture on all platforms. Does anyone know if 1Password 8 on macOS will also be an Electron app? Their Linux Electron app is pretty good and definitely much better than having no 1Password at all. However…

One reason I use 1Password is because it’s a native app. Electron apps never have the affordances of the platform, so are frustrating to use whenever you leave the “happy path”. Because it’s so heavily used this would be a reason to leave it. Separately, Electron is itself a large piece of code and integrating it would increase the attack surface — of a piece of security code! Another good reason to switch if this co…

To be fair: 1password native app on windows was horrible and felt 3 times slower than 8.0(electron) beta.
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