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The home computer as a cultural object is physically vanishing (2007)

contemporary-home-computing.org

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Re: The home computer as a cultural object is physically vanishing (2007)

#141

Post by handrous »

Nullabillity wrote: post #131
handrous wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Doesn't the sandboxing and limited access to the file system get in the way? Why would it get in the way? Any video editing software on it's going to be designed with that in mind, and will share with other video-related software just fine. Lots of desktop video editing software (Premiere, to pick one) start with "OK, step 1, import all the clips/videos for this project into this program" so even in the worst case…

> Why would it get in the way? How do plugins work on iOS?

Not sure that they do. They could, but I don't know of any significant video editing plugin ecosystems on iOS. Stuff's too rich for my blood—$200 to make overlay text look a certain way? $400 for a noise-reduction algo? Not for me and my casual stuff. Again, if you want actual pro software, you're looking at one of a couple desktop application vendors, that's true. If you're looking for pro-tier software for home use, and learning that pro-tier software is your main goal and/or you actually need what it can provide, then you're probably talking Adobe Premiere, specifically, and yeah, that's desktop only (and about $250/yr). If you just want to learn the process and techniques of non-linear video editing and put together (potentially quite good) edited videos or films, the iPad's capable enough (with the benefit that, in the original use case posted here, it's also a damn good drawing tablet and you can use it to shoot your videos, too, again, if you don't have actual pro-level needs), but I wouldn't argue it replaces a desktop with Premiere, for a bunch of reasons including that everyone assumes you've got Premiere (and often Aftereffects, too) available, when it comes to plugins.

Re: The home computer as a cultural object is physically vanishing (2007)

#142

Post by bitwize »

system2 wrote: post #76
bitwize wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When the M2 Mac Pro drops, the tables will turn: no PC will even nearly match it.

So an M2 can beat a AMD Ryzen Threadripper PRO 3995WX or a dual CPU mobo tower with 128gb ram, also a PCI nvme? LOL right.

The M2 isn't out yet, so we don't know what it can beat. But core for core, Apple Silicon has the best performance by a wide margin with much lower power consumption than any x86 part (because while we weren't looking, RISC architecture really did change everything). Plus, its on-chip memory will equate, in a Mac Pro-like system, to gigabytes of L3 cache. Add on to that that Big Sur and later are specially optimized for the Apple chips, meaning that performance cores won't be burdened with the background tasks the OS performs, leaving 100% of their throughput available for user applications. So yeah, core for core the Threadripper will get smoked, and I wouldn't be surprised if an M2 with half the number of performance cores as a Threadripper has remains competitive with the TR for representative tasks (such as video editing, rendering, and encoding).

Re: The home computer as a cultural object is physically vanishing (2007)

#143

Post by masswerk »

Regarding the physical presence of a small computer, something I actually miss is people hitting the monitor, when in despair, rather then the true culprit (as in "the box"). – There's actually some kind of magic in this misdirection.

With flat screens, this isn't a thing anymore. (Also, the kind of despair that would urge someone to attack the machine, has become increasingly more abstract, as has the underlying architecture causing the despair. What would you do? Take a plane to hit "the cloud"?)

Re: The home computer as a cultural object is physically vanishing (2007)

#144

Post by baud147258 »

masswerk wrote: post #143

Regarding the physical presence of a small computer, something I actually miss is people hitting the monitor, when in despair, rather then the true culprit (as in "the box"). – There's actually some kind of magic in this misdirection. With flat screens, this isn't a thing anymore. (Also, the kind of despair that would urge someone to attack the machine, has become increasingly more abstract, as has the underlying arc…

I mostly hit the keyboard. And curse (loudly at home, under my breath in the office)

Re: The home computer as a cultural object is physically vanishing (2007)

#145

Post by fiftyfifty »

handrous wrote: post #96
ecshafer wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is honestly an absurd proposition. A 13 inch screen Ipad pro with a keyboard and 2TB of memory is $2500. Video editing is something you want power, and a lot of screen real estate, and a good form factor. Even with the GPU shortage, you can buy an extremely powerful, capable, video editing desktop with two large 27" monitors for $1k. Even before you consider limitations in sandboxing, multi-application usage, an…

It depends on what you're doing and what your budget is. Shoot & edit on one device, plus an excellent drawing experience, is pretty compelling when you're talking about a device for a kid to learn on, and the main things it'll be used for are video & drawing. You don't need 2TB of built-in storage for that, either. Only way I can see that not being the option to beat, is if your goal is to learn the UI (not the conc…

Most devices these days including the iPad and things like Go Pros film in at least 720P which absolutely fills up storage space in no time at all. I started filming my kids' sporting events in HD and editing them on my laptop and I completely filled up 1 terabyte of storage on my computer in no time at all. Then I had to start playing the game of moving older stuff to external storage which totally sucks if you want to go back to it quickly. 1 minute of 1080P video at 60fps is around 200MB depending on the format, an hour is like 12 gigs. The only reasonable way to manage almost any amount of HD video is on a desktop system with loads of cheap(er) storage.

Re: The home computer as a cultural object is physically vanishing (2007)

#146

Post by rossdavidh »

eludwig wrote: post #108
samatman wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A tangent, but I've found the iPad Pro to be fabulous for video editing. I haven't hooked it up to a keyboard/mouse combo, or plugged it into a monitor, but it's quite capable of both of those things. I can tell you it's simply superior to a Wacom tablet for drawing, there I have a direct comparison. A PC/desktop will certainly exceed an iPad at some level: but now that the Pro model has an M1, it's unclear at what l…

>> I can tell you it's simply superior to a Wacom tablet for drawing IMO, yes & no. For certain types of work, an iPad Pro is amazing. For direct sketching, drawing, for sure. It's easily my favorite drawing table for these. For certain other types of work, for example: colorists work of filling large areas precisely within black lines (like comicbook coloring) or maneuvering around a huge document, a commercial grad…

She's doing storyboarding-type work, and we did check into the iPad option first before getting the Wacom (which I think might be Intuos). It did not measure up. Of course, the iPad does all kinds of other stuff, but I think that might be the problem. The Wacom is made for drawing, and that's about it, and thus it is very good at it, apparently.

Re: The home computer as a cultural object is physically vanishing (2007)

#147

Post by rossdavidh »

vlunkr wrote: post #99
rossdavidh wrote: post #50

My 15-year old daughter just recently got her first desktop. Why? Well, because instead of just consuming (which she does on her phone) or doing homework (chromebook), she wanted to do video editing, and also drawing using a Wacom tablet. She found that the non-desktop options were just not that great. Had it been a passing fancy, no doubt she would have done without the desktop, but it wasn't, so she got a tricked o…

> tricked out desktop (intended for gamers, I think) Generally this is just a marketing/SEO thing. A huge percentage of desktop hardware and accessories get the word "Gaming" slapped on the front even though they have nothing to do with gaming. Keyboards, mice, mousepads, headsets, speakers, monitors, cables, etc.

Principally, I think "gaming" now means "graphically high-powered". If you are going to be word processing, internet browsing, etc. then this is not as important and may not be worth the cost. So the desktops with a beefy GPU, etc. get called "gaming" as a shorthand for that.

Re: The home computer as a cultural object is physically vanishing (2007)

#148

Post by ekianjo »

samatman wrote: post #68
rossdavidh wrote: post #50

My 15-year old daughter just recently got her first desktop. Why? Well, because instead of just consuming (which she does on her phone) or doing homework (chromebook), she wanted to do video editing, and also drawing using a Wacom tablet. She found that the non-desktop options were just not that great. Had it been a passing fancy, no doubt she would have done without the desktop, but it wasn't, so she got a tricked o…

A tangent, but I've found the iPad Pro to be fabulous for video editing. I haven't hooked it up to a keyboard/mouse combo, or plugged it into a monitor, but it's quite capable of both of those things. I can tell you it's simply superior to a Wacom tablet for drawing, there I have a direct comparison. A PC/desktop will certainly exceed an iPad at some level: but now that the Pro model has an M1, it's unclear at what l…

An Ipad Pro cant compare with a device that has a much larger screen.

Re: The home computer as a cultural object is physically vanishing (2007)

#149

Post by wil421 »

ecshafer wrote: post #85
samatman wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A tangent, but I've found the iPad Pro to be fabulous for video editing. I haven't hooked it up to a keyboard/mouse combo, or plugged it into a monitor, but it's quite capable of both of those things. I can tell you it's simply superior to a Wacom tablet for drawing, there I have a direct comparison. A PC/desktop will certainly exceed an iPad at some level: but now that the Pro model has an M1, it's unclear at what l…

This is honestly an absurd proposition. A 13 inch screen Ipad pro with a keyboard and 2TB of memory is $2500. Video editing is something you want power, and a lot of screen real estate, and a good form factor. Even with the GPU shortage, you can buy an extremely powerful, capable, video editing desktop with two large 27" monitors for $1k. Even before you consider limitations in sandboxing, multi-application usage, an…

iPads and Apple’s processors had purpose built processes for video editing. My M1 Air is faster than my 2017 15 inch hexa core and respectably close to my 2070 Super in Handbrake. You can probably get away with an M1 iPad Pro for a LOT of tasks. The T2 in the touch bar chip on my 2017 is faster than the intel processor in some encoding tasks I’ve done.

Re: The home computer as a cultural object is physically vanishing (2007)

#150

Post by howaboutnope »

samatman wrote: post #68
rossdavidh wrote: post #50

My 15-year old daughter just recently got her first desktop. Why? Well, because instead of just consuming (which she does on her phone) or doing homework (chromebook), she wanted to do video editing, and also drawing using a Wacom tablet. She found that the non-desktop options were just not that great. Had it been a passing fancy, no doubt she would have done without the desktop, but it wasn't, so she got a tricked o…

A tangent, but I've found the iPad Pro to be fabulous for video editing. I haven't hooked it up to a keyboard/mouse combo, or plugged it into a monitor, but it's quite capable of both of those things. I can tell you it's simply superior to a Wacom tablet for drawing, there I have a direct comparison. A PC/desktop will certainly exceed an iPad at some level: but now that the Pro model has an M1, it's unclear at what l…

> So, I talked to Steve on the phone [about adding a standard pen and penholder]. I said, “Look Steve. You know, you’ve made something that is perfect for 2-year-olds and perfect for 92-year-olds. But everybody in-between learns to use tools.”

-- Alan Kay

Non-slave adults are the vanishing breed, the onslaught against general and self-determined computing is just one of the symptoms of that.

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