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Amazon is reportedly negotiating to acquire MGM for about $9B

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Re: Amazon is reportedly negotiating to acquire MGM for about $9B

#141
post #6

Is the SEC and FTC ever going to do their job? They have failed us in the 21st century. Shareholder value over everything else. It would be nice for some regulation to attack all this rent seeking.

what job do you want the FTC to do here? I assume you think there is an antitrust angle on this potential acquisition? I am an economist and that is my field. I disagree with your take, if that is what you mean. This is a vertical merger. Vertical mergers are quite different in their welfare effects to consumers than horizontal mergers. Vertical mergers can frequently be welfare-improving to consumers. Indeed, this i…

> This has a decent chance to be pro-consumer.

What does it mean to be "pro-consumer"? You can't reasonably use that metric to decide antitrust cases if you aren't directly querying consumers on whether they want the company to be broken up or not. When the FTC decides what is or isn't pro-consumer, that's the same as me claiming that I know how you're going to vote on issue X, and then claiming that you're "voting against your interests" when you vote the opposite way.

Anyway, there's another lens besides consumer welfare and monopoly here: diversity provides protection against the unforeseen, as well as an increased rate of innovation. We see this in natural selection where species routinely go extinct and, on the occasion, whole classes of animals are wiped off the planet but life as a whole continues because of the diversity before any event.

When we accept high concentration in our economy, we lose the safeguards that come with diversity. With enough concentration the unforeseen events become actual existential threats. I'm not going to claim we're there yet -- if Amazon failed we still have Walmart, and Azure, etc -- but I didn't see anything in your viewpoint that protects against a future where some things become "too big to fail".

tl;dr diversity is a desirable property of most systems, and an antitrust framework should consider it.

Re: Amazon is reportedly negotiating to acquire MGM for about $9B

#142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The better way to address this would be reducing copyright lengths to 20 years or something reasonable.

That means losing out exclusivity on endless remakes, reboots and sequels. Since that's the majority of Hollywood money, I sincerely doubt it will change.

Trademarks would prevent derivative works after expiration.

Re: Amazon is reportedly negotiating to acquire MGM for about $9B

#143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amazon always has and continues to invest internally to expand e.g., new AWS regions, warehouse automation through robotics most of which are extremely capital intensive. Though your observation is right that MGM acquisition does make sense for Amazon because they OK to pay a premium to fast-track expanding their media business. The way I see it, Amazon, as a growth machine, keeps its growth options (organic/inorgani…

Eastern companies like yamaha and hyaundai. dirtbikes to pianos, cars to housing

> dirtbikes to pianos

Yamaha's logo is three tuning forks. Always cracks me up seeing that on a dirtbike.

Re: Amazon is reportedly negotiating to acquire MGM for about $9B

#144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Vertical integration in steel production could as easily involve intellectual property as it does here. As a hypothetical example, imagine if Apple had sourced the M1 chip from a third party which it now proposed to buy. There would be intellectual property at stake there too. This case is no different. And indeed, in the Apple hypothetical you could well expect consumers to be better off and for exactly the same rea…

> Vertical integration in steel production could as easily involve intellectual property as it does here. I didn't say Intellectual Property, I said Copyright. Copyright—much more than other forms of IP—has a significant impact on our shared culture and cultural transmission. Yes, there may be other factors with IP that we should consider when dealing with mergers, but end-users and everyday people are harmed much mu…

Based on this line of reasoning, literally any acquisition is bad. What's the limiting principle?

Re: Amazon is reportedly negotiating to acquire MGM for about $9B

#145

There reality of current equity valuations is such that, if sustained, there is some some pretty savage consolidation to come. The only limit is antitrust, or fear of. $9bn is 0.5% of AMZN's current market cap, so $9bn represents a daily price fluctuation. They also have $45bn in cash reserves, so amazon could buy 5 MGMs without borrowing or issuing stock. That's not even a lot! Apple, Google & FB have $200bn, $140bn…

Amazon always has and continues to invest internally to expand e.g., new AWS regions, warehouse automation through robotics most of which are extremely capital intensive. Though your observation is right that MGM acquisition does make sense for Amazon because they OK to pay a premium to fast-track expanding their media business. The way I see it, Amazon, as a growth machine, keeps its growth options (organic/inorgani…

Diversifying used to be the norm (eg Thorn EMI, Virgin, etc). It’s more of a modern trend to specialise in one field.

Re: Amazon is reportedly negotiating to acquire MGM for about $9B

#146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m all ears if you have a good idea. “Obviously ridiculous” sounds like a great standard to block an acquisition. Explain what’s obviously ridiculous about it. I judge these things on the potential for harm to consumers. I don’t see that here. Perhaps you do. Do you see this leading to increased prices or a reduction in quantity consumed? (And of what, btw?) That’s how we make these judgments so if it’s obvious to y…

But it's not just about 'consumers' is it? I mean its great and all that you are playing devils advocate and using your education to argue on behalf of a Trillion dollar corporation but this isn't just about what an economist thinks, especially since economists get it wrong all the time. This entire discussion is about peoples natural reaction to a super large entity, that as one of your supporters put it "single-han…

> But it's not just about 'consumers' is it?

Who else is it about? If any sort of investigation is to be brought into it, the main investigation would be on behalf of consumers right?

> "single-handedly makes up 4% of the US economy"

Correction: 4% of the US stock market, not the US economy.

Regardless, is your argument that any company that is at a certain threshold % of the US economy/stock market should not do acquisitions or expand their business?

Re: Amazon is reportedly negotiating to acquire MGM for about $9B

#147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eastern companies like yamaha and hyaundai. dirtbikes to pianos, cars to housing

> dirtbikes to pianos Yamaha's logo is three tuning forks. Always cracks me up seeing that on a dirtbike.

Motorcycles have forks too, but if they resonate at 440 Hz you have got issues...

Re: Amazon is reportedly negotiating to acquire MGM for about $9B

#148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>it forces different services to compete against each other in a way that produces more and better content overall It seems more like another avenue through which a small number of mega-corporations can control ever increasing shares of the media marketplace to me. In my view, some sort of mandatory licensing scheme would force individually owned production companies to compete against each other to produce the best…

A small number of mega corporations have always controlled the media marketplace, the difference is streaming is shaking things up and making a new set of mega-corporations in addition to the existing ones.

>A small number of mega corporations have always controlled the media marketplace

Always? No.

After the deregulation of the Clinton era? Yes.

Fun fact: At the start of the Clinton administration, banks could not operate in more than one state.

Re: Amazon is reportedly negotiating to acquire MGM for about $9B

#149
post #6

Is the SEC and FTC ever going to do their job? They have failed us in the 21st century. Shareholder value over everything else. It would be nice for some regulation to attack all this rent seeking.

what job do you want the FTC to do here? I assume you think there is an antitrust angle on this potential acquisition? I am an economist and that is my field. I disagree with your take, if that is what you mean. This is a vertical merger. Vertical mergers are quite different in their welfare effects to consumers than horizontal mergers. Vertical mergers can frequently be welfare-improving to consumers. Indeed, this i…

As an economist, what do you think of the Amazon Antitrust Paradox?

https://www.yalelawjournal.org/note/amazons-antitrust-parado...

> The current framework in antitrust fails to register certain forms of anticompetitive harm and therefore is unequipped to promote real competition—a shortcoming that is illuminated and amplified in the context of online platforms and data-driven markets. This failure stems both from assumptions embedded in the Chicago School framework and from the way this framework assesses competition.

> Notably, the present approach fails even if one believes that antitrust should promote only consumer interests. Critically, consumer interests include not only cost but also product quality, variety, and innovation. Protecting these long-term interests requires a much thicker conception of “consumer welfare” than what guides the current approach. But more importantly, the undue focus on consumer welfare is misguided. It betrays legislative history, which reveals that Congress passed antitrust laws to promote a host of political economic ends—including our interests as workers, producers, entrepreneurs, and citizens. It also mistakenly supplants a concern about process and structure (i.e., whether power is sufficiently distributed to keep markets competitive) with a calculation regarding outcome (i.e., whether consumers are materially better off).

> Antitrust law and competition policy should promote not welfare but competitive markets. By refocusing attention back on process and structure, this approach would be faithful to the legislative history of major antitrust laws. It would also promote actual competition—unlike the present framework, which is overseeing concentrations of power that risk precluding real competition.

Re: Amazon is reportedly negotiating to acquire MGM for about $9B

#150
post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who said anything about a reboot? A new series is fine. Universe got better with age and perspective. Atlantis was already solid when it was new. I wouldn't even mind a The Expanse/Stargate crossover where they turn out to be parallel universes. Stargate Universe already hinted at a new Big Bad that could be the one they're hinting at in The Expanse.

Unfortunately, reboots are what usually happens with developed shows. Stargate universe (not to be confused with Stargate Universe) has grown very large over the run of the TV shows, and more importantly, it evolved . By SG:Universe, Stargateverse looked much different than what it was when SG-1 started. This creates a problem for future development - existing canon severely constraints the writers. Between writers c…

I look at what happened and see a lot of good. I like Picard, Discovery, Lower Decks, and the reboot movies. Discovery found a way to reuse a lot of existing canon and essentially reboot it. I think it worked well. It took some time to get things moving in the right direction as all Star Trek series do, and the showrunner changes didn't help, but I look forward to what's next.
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