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Europe: close to power grid blackout (49,74Hz power line frequency)

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Re: Europe: close to power grid blackout (49,74Hz power line frequency)

#141
post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That just means that you can't max out all your circuits at the same time. I'm pretty sure that's considered normal. If instead of FIR panels you use a heat pump (isn't that the main point of electrical heating), would you still need 32A? And if you're cooking and baking with 10 kW, would you still need heating at the same time? And a 7 kW heat pump water heater should give you ~10 liters per minute of hot shower wat…

Heat pump is a no, thank you. 10k for air source, noisy, ugly, big; 3x100m deep holes for ground source, don't even want to know the price. EDIT: for <5k I'd have the whole house on FIR panels and electric boiler, then I could spend another 5k on solar.

$9k buys a three zone ductless multi split heat pump, installed, in a area with very high labor costs. This heats and cools and can modulate to a reasonable degree. (This price is for a Fujitsu system — I don’t know the price for other vendors.)

Maybe you can install a cheaper FIR system, but that system is actually just electric resistance heat. Sure, maybe you can operate in a regime where the mean radiant temperature where you are is enough higher than the actual air temperature to save some power, but that had better be a pretty big effect to overcome the 3-4x efficiency improvement of a heat pump. And did I mention that the heat pump can cool, too?

Re: Europe: close to power grid blackout (49,74Hz power line frequency)

#142

Without really understanding much what is going on, this seems to be related: "System split registered in the synchronous area of Continental Europe – Incident now resolved" https://www.entsoe.eu/news/2021/01/08/system-split-registere...

commentary in German: https://www.saurugg.net/2021/blog/stromversorgung/bedenklich...

Re: Europe: close to power grid blackout (49,74Hz power line frequency)

#145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems like a better solution would be batteries and/or the allowance of dirtier power generation (in emergencies). I can't even wrap my head around the regulatory nightmare of shutting off everyone's heat at night in January.

Dirtier power generation doesn't work because physics. Frequency gets too high (a few Hz or so), turbogenerators/turbines blow up. Frequency gets too low, resonances destroy them. Frequency shifts quickly, massive torque and current spikes ensue. Load is dumped, frequency ramps up quickly and voltage rises very quickly. There are a number of control and monitoring systems in a power plant which ought to prevent these…

"Dirtier power generation doesn't work because physics. Frequency gets too high (a few Hz or so), turbogenerators/turbines blow up. Frequency gets too low, resonances destroy them."

You very obviously have no idea what you are talking about. Turbines blowing up because they spin a few Hz faster? Mine never did. Turbine destroyed because of "resonances" when freq too low? Mine never did that either. Not the 1100MW one at my old job, nor the two 500MW ones at the job before that and also not the 12MW one at my current job.

Re: Europe: close to power grid blackout (49,74Hz power line frequency)

#146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dirtier power generation doesn't work because physics. Frequency gets too high (a few Hz or so), turbogenerators/turbines blow up. Frequency gets too low, resonances destroy them. Frequency shifts quickly, massive torque and current spikes ensue. Load is dumped, frequency ramps up quickly and voltage rises very quickly. There are a number of control and monitoring systems in a power plant which ought to prevent these…

"Dirtier power generation doesn't work because physics. Frequency gets too high (a few Hz or so), turbogenerators/turbines blow up. Frequency gets too low, resonances destroy them." You very obviously have no idea what you are talking about. Turbines blowing up because they spin a few Hz faster? Mine never did. Turbine destroyed because of "resonances" when freq too low? Mine never did that either. Not the 1100MW one…

Hey, could you please review https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and stick to the rules when posting here? It's not ok to attack another user like that on this site, regardless of how wrong someone is or you feel they are.

It sounds like you know a lot about this topic, which is great, but please omit personal swipes—that will make it much easier for people to learn from your posts.

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