Zoom executive charged with disrupting meetings commemorating Tiananmen Square • Hacker News Board

Re: Zoom executive charged with disrupting meetings commemorating Tiananmen Square

#141

Post by tony101 » Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 6:09 AM UTC

jrochkind1 wrote: post #71

"unlawful conspiracy to transfer a means of identification." I don't think I've ever heard that phrase before. It's a federal crime? What does it mean?

"Whoever, in a circumstance described in subsection (c) of this section ... knowingly transfers, possesses, or uses, without lawful authority, a means of identification of another person with the intent to commit, or to aid or abet, or in connection with, any unlawful activity that constitutes a violation of Federal law, or that constitutes a felony under any applicable State or local law ... shall be punished as provided in subsection (b) of this section."

(18 USC 1028(a)(7))

"the term “means of identification” means any name or number that may be used, alone or in conjunction with any other information, to identify a specific individual, including any— (A)name, social security number, date of birth, official State or government issued driver’s license or identification number, alien registration number, government passport number, employer or taxpayer identification number; (B)unique biometric data, such as fingerprint, voice print, retina or iris image, or other unique physical representation; (C)unique electronic identification number, address, or routing code; or (D)telecommunication identifying information or access device (as defined in section 1029(e));"

(18 USC 1028(d)(7))

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/1028

Criminal complaint with details: https://www.justice.gov/opa/press-release/file/1347146/downl...

Re: Zoom executive charged with disrupting meetings commemorating Tiananmen Square

#142

Post by Darkphibre » Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 6:12 AM UTC

astura wrote: post #127

rosywoozlechan wrote: post #16

There's even an FBI wanted poster for this executive: https://www.fbi.gov/wanted/counterintelligence/xinjiang-jin/...

Where did they get these pictures? They look like mugshots but he's not in custody.

Passport, maybe? You have to present a photo that's extremely similar for facial detection algorithms to train identifying you in the future.

Re: Zoom executive charged with disrupting meetings commemorating Tiananmen Square

#143

Post by treepunch » Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 6:13 AM UTC

archibaldJ wrote: post #136

I’m working on a ZOOM-alternative for online events and gatherings that uses twilio: https://lo.fish It is built on eilixir & will be open-sourced soon. (The next step I’m looking to make it E2E.) There are also existing ZOOM-alternatives like https://gather.town

>post an invite-only service

>leave no information on how to get an invite

Re: Zoom executive charged with disrupting meetings commemorating Tiananmen Square

#144

Post by indolering » Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 6:22 AM UTC

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #114

sneak wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Forget the charge - we should strive to presume the innocence of anyone charged with anything. Bringing charges is not evidence.

But crimes of mere "possession" (e.g. child pornography, drugs) are especially susceptible to framing because the existence of the contraband in a person's personal effects are all that is needed to presume guilt. Child pornography, or really any digital asset, is doubly suspect because it is so much easier to "place" these digital assets on someone's computer or phone, whereas with drugs you'd need physical access t…

I have brown friends who get searched every time they are pulled over or go through airport security. I have had friends who were told to STFU and take a frequenting ticket or spend the night in jail (and thus risk losing their minimum wage job). I even had a friend who was led to a cop car by the FBI but (thankfully) he refused to get in because there was a mysterious baggie in the back (which was surreptitiously spirited away on camera). Nothing happened in any of these cases.

Sigh - you can't trust cops even with physical possession and cameras rolling [1].

[1]: https://www.topic.com/runningfromcops

Re: Zoom executive charged with disrupting meetings commemorating Tiananmen Square

#145

Post by [deleted] » Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 6:30 AM UTC

indolering wrote: post #144

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But crimes of mere "possession" (e.g. child pornography, drugs) are especially susceptible to framing because the existence of the contraband in a person's personal effects are all that is needed to presume guilt. Child pornography, or really any digital asset, is doubly suspect because it is so much easier to "place" these digital assets on someone's computer or phone, whereas with drugs you'd need physical access t…

I have brown friends who get searched every time they are pulled over or go through airport security. I have had friends who were told to STFU and take a frequenting ticket or spend the night in jail (and thus risk losing their minimum wage job). I even had a friend who was led to a cop car by the FBI but (thankfully) he refused to get in because there was a mysterious baggie in the back (which was surreptitiously sp…

[deleted]

Re: Zoom executive charged with disrupting meetings commemorating Tiananmen Square

#146

Post by runawaybottle » Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 6:32 AM UTC

selimthegrim wrote: post #120

runawaybottle wrote: post #63

What are the chances these orders to co-opt people in China to do this is coming straight from the top of the CCP? There is a school of thought that provides a lot of analysis and evidence that the acceleration of the Holocaust was a bottom-up phenomenon (not a master plan made by Hitler years before). Hitler might have laid out details to exile the Jews, but there was no evidence he gave a direct order to begin full…

Really? Given Goebbels' Freudian slip here ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sportpalast_speech ) and the Wannsee conference?

So, the acceleration of the Holocaust occurred earlier around 1940-1941 when they were in Poland. By 1943, they had already done close to half the total killings (the number 6 million we agree on).

Check out the numbers in 1942 (this is just from one death camp, in 1941 they were doing the mass shootings pre-gas chambers):

https://advances.sciencemag.org/content/advances/5/1/eaau729...

By the time they were done, I guess they said ‘Yeah, this is the plan’.

Goebbels also has a history of instigating and letting things ‘play out’, Kristallnacht being the prime example. Even so, this wouldn’t be the guy up top that would deliver a clear plan on extermination. Similarly, they found no proof that even Hitler delivered clear plans on extermination (his end goal was exile initially). You pretty much have to find the shitbags in the sub leadership in Poland that took it to a new level (Himmler). So, yeah, I wouldn’t call it a Freudian slip if it happened in 1943, it was just shitbags latching on to a plan that was well into motion by then (not absolving anyone here on any level, Hitler/Goebbels set fertile ground for things to escalate organically). If anything, the death camps were planned to be closed (and were closed by 1944 by Nazis themselves) and erased from history to cover up.

Anyway, back to the point. I think China said ‘we need to do something about Muslim extremist, and anti nationalists’, and how that gets carried out is up to a lot of imagination, whether it be re-education camps, Hong Kong crackdown, or Zoom bombing. This is a country that will also work very hard to cover up all this bullshit when it’s all said and done.

I’m aware that this sounds like over-fitting, but I can’t help it, the pattern just fits in my eyes.

Re: Zoom executive charged with disrupting meetings commemorating Tiananmen Square

#147

Post by rixed » Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 6:32 AM UTC

Aarostotle wrote: post #123

tehjoker wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you think companies operating under the influence of the USG are better you've got another thing coming. EDIT: I like that whenever I post something negative about the USG in an anti-China thread, I go to -4 then bounce up later. It could be people are really that nationalistic. Who knows.

No, it’s just apples and oranges. The USA is a flawed constitutional republic that runs on a messy democratic process. It’s ugly sometimes, but it’s fundamentally good. The PRC is something else.

To be fair, the parent was not comparing those governments from a democracy standpoint, but was comparing their actions. Surely the Chinese government is currently more oppressive to its own population than the USG is, but it is also doubtlessly less oppressive to foreign populations, which may suggests that they differ in circumstances more than in essence and maybe why the parent equated them?

Re: Zoom executive charged with disrupting meetings commemorating Tiananmen Square

#148

Post by sillysaurusx » Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 6:37 AM UTC

indolering wrote: post #144

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But crimes of mere "possession" (e.g. child pornography, drugs) are especially susceptible to framing because the existence of the contraband in a person's personal effects are all that is needed to presume guilt. Child pornography, or really any digital asset, is doubly suspect because it is so much easier to "place" these digital assets on someone's computer or phone, whereas with drugs you'd need physical access t…

I have brown friends who get searched every time they are pulled over or go through airport security. I have had friends who were told to STFU and take a frequenting ticket or spend the night in jail (and thus risk losing their minimum wage job). I even had a friend who was led to a cop car by the FBI but (thankfully) he refused to get in because there was a mysterious baggie in the back (which was surreptitiously sp…

Since we're cherrypicking, I was reading over https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_roulette#Notable_incid... and found this gem:

On July 24, 1973, Dallas Police Officer Darrell L. Cain fatally shot Santos Rodriguez, a 12-year-old Mexican-American child, while interrogating him and his brother about a burglary. Cain shot Rodriguez while conducting Russian roulette on the brothers in an attempt to force a confession from them.

In fairness, that was the 70s. But the 70s were also "one generation ago," so it's not exactly ancient history.

(I could imagine myself being skeptical about your comment before having wised up a little, so I thought I'd chime in to say yes, this really does happen.)

Re: Zoom executive charged with disrupting meetings commemorating Tiananmen Square

#149

Post by derwiki » Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 6:38 AM UTC

hiidrew wrote: post #54

Seems like an early Christmas gift to Microsoft Teams

I want to think that.. but at the time I’m posting this, ZM is up after hours.

Re: Zoom executive charged with disrupting meetings commemorating Tiananmen Square

#150

Post by ulfw » Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 6:38 AM UTC

nradov wrote: post #85

rtx wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It all new, Zoom actually is one of the pioneers.

WebEx (acquired by Cisco) had all of the core functionality before Zoom.

The zoom founder even worked at WebEx. So yes.