Split Keyboard for Professionals • Hacker News Board

Re: Split Keyboard for Professionals

#141

Post by Benjamin_Dobell » Mon, Sep 28, 2020, 3:15 PM UTC

craigkilgo wrote: post #59

ahelwer wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do love the sculpt but they tend to die within a couple of years. I went through two of them before switching to something more durable. The build quality is just bad - many times my computer was behaving weirdly, traced to one of the function keys being stuck down (this also manifested as the keyboard eating new batteries within a couple of days).

This is my exact thought. I love it, but I'm about to retire my second one. It's almost worth just paying the price for a new one every couple of years though. I have two of the older Microsoft Natural keyboards from decades ago that I periodically switch to and they will probably last another 20 years.

I've got two MS Natural Ergonomic Keyboard 4000s in my cupboard. I'm currently on a Sculpt, but much preferred the 4000s. Unfortunately I uncovered their weakness - humidity.

I work from home with evaporative cooling over summer.

The first unit lasted a few years, but died on a humid summer day. Next one only lasted 12 months, again dying on a humid summer day.

First unit is irrecoverably dead. The second would come back to life after pulling it apart and cleaning with isopropyl alcohol, then die again a few days later (during summer). Issue is that the humidity seems to short the key matrix. If not careful it makes for some awkward typing mistakes.

The Sculpt seems a bit more resilient to humidity.

Re: Split Keyboard for Professionals

#142

Post by chrisBob » Mon, Sep 28, 2020, 3:16 PM UTC

I recently shopped for split keyboards, and the only real reason I didn't go with the UHK was price. It isn't exactly an ApplesApples comparison since I would have gotten accessories like the touchpoint for the UHK, but I went with a Kinesis Freestyle Pro instead and I have liked it a lot.

The biggest benefit to me wasn't the split, it was the programmability which both the UHK and the Freestyle Pro offer. I use the right half of the spacebar to change layers and have mapped the arrow keys to IJKL on the function layer. This plus remapping Caps to backspace has let me keep my hands on the home row MUCH more than typical and has made me more comfortable and a little more efficient.

My only complaint about programming the Kinesis Pro keyboard was the the order of key presses matters when using my remapped arrows in combination with command or option to move by a word, or to the beginning of the line: I must press the Fn shift key (the right half of my spacebar) before any of the modifier keys. This was very annoying at first, but my muscle memory caught up with it fairly quickly. I really like the fact that the UHK has fully customizable firmware and that would add some value to me, but maybe wouldn't matter too much to most people.

Re: Split Keyboard for Professionals

#143

Post by nxpnsv » Mon, Sep 28, 2020, 3:16 PM UTC

I have one of these. I bought because of the disappointing mac keyboard I had at the time. Took some time to arrive, not cheap but worth every cent. I love using it. Also a major conversation piece.

Re: Split Keyboard for Professionals

#144

Post by simias » Mon, Sep 28, 2020, 3:16 PM UTC

oskardenandre wrote: post #23

cliffwarden wrote: post #17

I just picked up a moonlander that i'm really living. https://www.zsa.io/moonlander/

I am on the fence about this one, care to push me over? (I already have the Ez)

I've had an Ez for years and I'm typing this on my brand new Moonlander. I think it's nice, but I don't think it's that much of an upgrade over the Ez. The new thumb cluster is a bit better than the EZ IMO, but it's not a complete win because of the hinge that creates a pretty wide gap between the main board and the thumb cluster.

I don't regret my purchase but if I were you I'd wait for something a bit more consequential, maybe a Moonlander Mk2. Or a more drastically different keyboard, like a manuform or a kyria for instance.

Re: Split Keyboard for Professionals

#145

Post by TylerE » Mon, Sep 28, 2020, 3:17 PM UTC

dkdk8283 wrote: post #15

I used the microsoft natural keyboard for years and now the kinesis freestyle. I don’t know why split keyboards aren’t more popular. Proper ergonomics are important or your career could be interrupted due to RSI.

Yeah, I've been using MS Naturals for work for years.

Great shape, terrible switches.

If someone would make one with light Topre switches I would pay pretty much any price up to $1000 for it.

Re: Split Keyboard for Professionals

#146

Post by throwanem » Mon, Sep 28, 2020, 3:17 PM UTC

jjkaczor wrote: post #79

Myself, I have been using a Kinesis RGB Edge with the "lift-kit" for about a month. Have never been a perfect, trained touch-typist - so there has been a learning curve, but it is worth it. My wrists feel so much better, and I am almost back to full speed. (Previously, I would just use laptop KB's). The only complaints... Not from me, but when I am on web meetings, I have to be on mute, because everyone finds the KB…

Everyone's keyboard is too loud to use unmuted in a call, including and especially MBP built-ins.

It's just that some folks care enough to mute for the sake of others' ears, and some folks, not so much.

Re: Split Keyboard for Professionals

#147

Post by simias » Mon, Sep 28, 2020, 3:18 PM UTC

wegs wrote: post #81

simias wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>One of the reasons is overlap. Your hands do occasionally hit keys on the other side. When I switched to a split keyboard I did have this problem at first (with the B and 6 keys in particular on a QWERTY layout) but it took me a week to relearn that. In particular if you use an ortholinear layout on each side there's really no reason to go fishing for keys with the wrong hand. This in turn means that you can add new…

My goalposts are "a keyboard which works for me." That's where they were, and that's where they will be. If I give up a few things I like about my existing keyboard to get what you like about your keyboard, that's a bad deal. I think that's true for most people. The type of mechanical keys on my keyboards really reduce the amount of strain on my wrist relative to membrane keyboards. It's not just a matter of taste. T…

I think it's you use of "horrible" that bothered me. I can understand being disappointed that a split keyboard doesn't have a trackpoint, but in no way does that make it "horrible" IMO.

Re: Split Keyboard for Professionals

#148

Post by Symbiote » Mon, Sep 28, 2020, 3:19 PM UTC

gotoliao wrote: post #127

ashtonkem wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One that’ll actually last? No. Even the Sculpt, which doesn’t have nice switches, is over $50. These things are made in such small numbers that they’ll never get economies of scale. They’re typically 2x the cost of even the already high price of regular mechanical keyboards.

That makes me wonder why Logitech is not mass producing one already!

Logitech used to make a split keyboard -- it was the first split keyboard I owned. It had normal keys rather than the low-profile ones I dislike.

This year, they introduced a low-profile split keyboard [1], but wanting a normal-profile one is what led me to assemble a DIY kit myself.

[1] $130: https://www.logitech.com/en-us/products/keyboards/k860-split...

Re: Split Keyboard for Professionals

#149

Post by bradly » Mon, Sep 28, 2020, 3:19 PM UTC

jjkaczor wrote: post #79

Myself, I have been using a Kinesis RGB Edge with the "lift-kit" for about a month. Have never been a perfect, trained touch-typist - so there has been a learning curve, but it is worth it. My wrists feel so much better, and I am almost back to full speed. (Previously, I would just use laptop KB's). The only complaints... Not from me, but when I am on web meetings, I have to be on mute, because everyone finds the KB…

> when I am on web meetings, I have to be on mute, because everyone finds the KB noise too loud when I am typing

Have you looked into swapping out the switches? It looks like they aren't hot-swappable, but de-soldering switches isn't too difficult and there are a ton of amazing silent switches out right now. Check out Zealios for a great silent tactile switch.

Re: Split Keyboard for Professionals

#150

Post by secabeen » Mon, Sep 28, 2020, 3:20 PM UTC

anotherevan wrote: post #68

I'm a long time MS Natural 4000 user. That said, I think the X-Bows Knight keyboard looks interesting. Thumb keys for enter, ctrl and shift. Still has function keys which a lot of these other keyboards don't (and some of us still use). https://x-bows.com/products/x-bows-knight-ergonomic-mechanic...

Yeah, I love my 4000, I bought 3 of them a few months back, when I started being concerned they would go EOL. Right now they're hard to find again, hopefully they'll do another production run.