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Nubank acquires Cognitect

cognitect.com

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Re: Nubank acquires Cognitect

#141

Post by jcadam »

KingMob wrote: post #95
jcadam wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've found CIDER superior to Cursive for Clojurescript, specifically. I use a combination of IntelliJ (with the emacs keybindings) and emacs depending on which language I'm working with. Most of my projects involve two or more languages, so I'll usually have both editors open all day :) As an aside, I'm starting to become a fan of Kotlin for backends (with some Clojure sprinkled in where it offers a big advantage), a…

Funny, I left Cider for Cursive a few years ago, because back then, Cursive had the better cljs support.

It's probably a result of my using shadow-cljs rather than figwheel. Cursive will catch up eventually, I'm sure.

Re: Nubank acquires Cognitect

#142

Post by johnfn »

geokon wrote: post #134

Does this mean Closure will continue to become more and more server/web focused? I could have the wrong impression, but from all the dead libraries I've come across it feels like it used to be all over the place with people doing math, visualizations/art, music, people trying to run on Android (seemingly the only JVM language that has no Android ecosystem/workflow.. crazy) etc.. Now a lot of that has atrophied and lo…

I think what you might be seeing is actually just a decline in interest of the language in general: https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=US&q=%...

Re: Nubank acquires Cognitect

#143

Post by raphaeljlps »

whoisjuan wrote: post #101
juskrey wrote: post #86

Pretty strange how no one else sees that banks are very very fragile institutions, plus this one is heavily VC-ed, which makes everything they claim in public irrelevant (this is if we want to trust what any bank says at all). What is relevant is that Cognitect will now have 100% of income coming from the single (and fragile) source, they now do not have to compete and survive on their own, they can't say "no" when h…

How is a bank a fragile institution? Banks are the most heavily insured and protected institutions in any modern country. In the US for example, banks not only contribute to federal insurance but also have built joint private reserves to weather economic turmoil. In the modern world banks rarely go bankrupt because if they did that would tank any confidence in the economy and create incredible chaos. Even in failed s…

Just to clarify, Nubank is not an actual/formal bank in Brazil. They have operating licenses as Financial institution and Payment institution though.

Re: Nubank acquires Cognitect

#144

Post by darthrupert »

alexbanks wrote: post #133
orolle wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is nature of the problem space which requires you to produce high quality code. If you have a small error in your program, the financial market participants will use it against you to profit. What you loose, others win! Google "fat finger" for examples. In banking you have to keep track of every transactions, see "double accounting". You never delete a transaction, you only retract! Mutablity can cause you a lot o…

> It is nature of the problem space which requires you to produce high quality code. Would love to see any actual data or studies showing that functional programming implicitly produces "high quality code".

That’s unfortunately hard to find, since hardly any customers require that these days. Fast and cheap is where it’s at.

Re: Nubank acquires Cognitect

#146

Post by jonahbenton »

juskrey wrote: post #136
jonahbenton wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With respect, I see where you are coming from, but would argue it isn't necessarily the right read, either in terms of banks, or in terms of Clojure, though there is nuance. Banks are systemic actors in the financial system. They have privileges granted only to them, requirements that only they have to meet. It is HARD to build and operate a bank, whether in the US or in another country. From a "fragility" perspectiv…

I have no issues with financial things per se - I have built several financial systems (from crypto to funds management) with Datomic and Clojure myself. And this is also one of the reasons I think having sole bank as your owner is a really really bad thing.

Say more? Would be helpful for others to further articulate your observations and opinions. No one has all the answers. For all who have a stake a full diversity of views is best.

Re: Nubank acquires Cognitect

#147

Post by jcadam »

randompwd wrote: post #79
jcadam wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've found CIDER superior to Cursive for Clojurescript, specifically. I use a combination of IntelliJ (with the emacs keybindings) and emacs depending on which language I'm working with. Most of my projects involve two or more languages, so I'll usually have both editors open all day :) As an aside, I'm starting to become a fan of Kotlin for backends (with some Clojure sprinkled in where it offers a big advantage), a…

Using Spring with Kotlin or other?

Yea, spring boot. When 90% of what you're doing on the backend is gluing a bunch of different Java technologies together, Clojure becomes hard to justify. Fortunately, mixing JVM languages together on the same project isn't a big deal so you can bring in some targeted Clojure where needed.

Kotlin is great because it's the closest thing to a general-purpose Java replacement I've seen. The interop support between Kotlin and Java is outstanding.

Re: Nubank acquires Cognitect

#148

Post by gdsdfe »

keeganpoppen wrote: post #84
tom_b wrote: post #81

Congratulations to Cognitect. Hopefully the acquisition will help Rich's retirement funding. (see 'History of Clojure' for the not-so-insider joke here) I have had the pleasure of "using Clojure in anger" and for a few years was very dedicated to learning how to use it effectively. This was a significant step up for my general programming skills and the simplicity of the language often saved me from myself with respe…

(for anyone who doesn't get it, Rich funded Clojure development via his retirement savings from 2005 until he ran out in 2009 https://dl.acm.org/doi/pdf/10.1145/3386321 )

Oh wow! I didn't know that

Re: Nubank acquires Cognitect

#149

Post by darthrupert »

dig1 wrote: post #60
scribu wrote: post #20

Did anyone else notice that the biggest non-academic supporters of functional programming seem to be financial institutions? Is it due to the nature of the problem space? Is it because finance people tend to be more analytical? Something else?

Mainly because of the problem space. Banking/finance is a complex field with many moving parts: card processing, validation, encryption, currency exchange and tons of certification stuff (I believe Nubank's primary focus is card processing). Didn't even touch other financial fields like investing, credit handling, or any kind of trading. The software is always expected to be correct, never fail and fast. Otherwise, s…

Doesn’t banking actually use double accounting to ensure not losing money instead of relying on something as brittle as software?

Then again, Wirecard happened. But perhaps that wasn’t exactly banking.

Re: Nubank acquires Cognitect

#150

Post by beders »

geokon wrote: post #134

Does this mean Closure will continue to become more and more server/web focused? I could have the wrong impression, but from all the dead libraries I've come across it feels like it used to be all over the place with people doing math, visualizations/art, music, people trying to run on Android (seemingly the only JVM language that has no Android ecosystem/workflow.. crazy) etc.. Now a lot of that has atrophied and lo…

It's not untypical for clojure libs to appear "dead". They will work just fine. Some libs are just "done"!
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