Sounds like some unionized grad students decided to go on strike on their own, without the unions approval. Firing doesn't seem unreasonable to me in that case, and it certainly isn't "union busting" as Bernie Sanders said in the article, given that the school has an agreement with the union. If you never could get fired for striking, it would allow employees to hold the school hostage indefinitely while making unreasonable demands (not that the demands in this case were necessarily unreasonable, just that I don't think firing strikers is inherently bad).
UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay
141–150 of 445 posts
Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay
#142Earlier quoted context omitted.
I agree that striking when its convenient is worthless, but at the same time, I have various emails from my direct TAs and the COLA organization as a whole mentioning the intent is to not harm undergrads, but here we are... Additionally, I'm not sure where youre getting the students are "entitled". I work and take loans out in order to go to this school, takes classes, and receive my grades. Am I entitled for wanting…
Name calling, binary thinking and whining aren't constructive. Good luck in the real world if you haven't yet learned the Golden Rule or grown thicker skin, because a degree won't matter if your attitude is reactive or poor.
You've broken the site guidelines repeatedly in this thread and now have even crossed into personal attack. That's not ok, so please stop.
It's especially not ok to harass a new user in this way; who are we if that's how we treat people who are trying to join this community?
Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay
#143I see a lot of discussion about the consequences of TAs withholding grades. This situation is a consequence of poor management at UCSC. Every other university I'm familiar with makes faculty responsible for submitting grades. It's inconceivable to me why TAs would be responsible for grades. TAs should be teaching assistants, not adjunct faculty.
Edit: I read "assigning grades" to mean assigning the final grades for the course, not grading homework and exams. I'm pretty sure this is the responsibilities the TAs had, because UCLA sent out a memo to all the faculty explaining that senate faculty are responsible for grades here.
Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay
#144Earlier quoted context omitted.
Name calling, binary thinking and whining aren't constructive. Good luck in the real world if you haven't yet learned the Golden Rule or grown thicker skin, because a degree won't matter if your attitude is reactive or poor.
> Name Calling I did not mean to come across this way or call you any names - can you point where I did so I won't repeat it? My skin is plenty thick, and this back and forth isn't meant to be whining. I'm just curious about your approach to this and it is fun to hear others perspectives, especially on such a polarizing topic. I'm a little perplexed on this reply to be honest. How is this constructive? I'm open to he…
I'm the lead moderator here. Your comments are fine, you didn't call names, and you're welcome here. I hope you'll continue to particpate!
Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay
#145Earlier quoted context omitted.
> The administration is not withholding grades It clearly has the resources to provide you with your grades, it's not like the specific grad students are the only ones being able to grade random undergrad work. It appears it's failing to provide the service you pay it for.
You're absolutely right in that they have the resources to get these graded. Another comment I posted down below describes my grade situation and how I've been asked to help grade (for pay). I imagine in six months time I'll have my grades, but the wait is absolutely wrong. Other students are attempting to graduate, but their requirements are not met because of withheld grades by their TAs. Can they afford another qu…
The university is preventing people from graduating, not the TAs. The university could have professors grade their own exams. The university could hire undergraduates like you to grade exams. The university could also let anyone graduate that they want, the university is the body that enforces these requirements, not the TAs. They could send a memo tomorrow saying they would aggregate your other grades, or let you graduate provisionally, or waive whatever requirement the university itself has put in place, but they aren't because by not doing so they turn undergraduates like you against graduates. And from the looks of your comments they have succeeded.
Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay
#146There are about 1800 UCSC graduate students [1]. From this 2014-15 UCSC budget report [2] there is a very near 2:1 masters:phd graduation ratio. Assuming there are 2 years of masters students and 6 of PhD at any one time, that makes PhD students 60% of “graduate students”. Let’s make this easy by saying 1000 PhD students (if anything I imagine it’s way less than this — as I understand, monetizing masters students has…
Vice seems to indicate that 22k is the minimum salary, not average: https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/wxe45b/graduate-student-s...
Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay
#147Earlier quoted context omitted.
Why do you (and others) think that education and academia is somehow special and not the same as, say, acting (or any career) where people regularly earn no money and work bad 2nd jobs just to survive and do something they love or want as a career? In a free market system nobody is telling you to choose that career and a University and (typically) a non-profit doesn't have any particular incentive to not act in their…
Society needs researchers - it doesn’t need actors.
HN needs not to have a flamewar about this.
Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay
#148Earlier quoted context omitted.
Striking when it's convenient is worthless. Perhaps if the students weren't so entitled, they'd understand that solidarity is important and that grades should be handled. Furthermore, you have to realize the university is punishing you to turn you against the grad students... and it appears they have succeeded. If I were an ugrad there, I'd be right there with the grad students. I was an ugrad at another UC where 2/3…
Is it Ok to strike when that will hurt innocents? I think we can all agree that having nurses strike and abandon care of their patients is unfair to those patients. This fight should be between UCSC and the graduates, not holding innocent undergrads hostage in the middle.
The only reason why undergraduates are 'held hostage' is due the policies of the university. The reason why grades are not posted is due to the university. The reason why people aren't able to graduate is due to policies stipulated by the university.
In most other universities, professors submit grades and are free to grade their own exams. TAs are there to just get through the stack of exams a little faster than the professor working on that same stack themselves. The TAs don't hold any sacred power in this scenario, they aren't needed at all actually, they just add an extra sets of hands to check or cross out answers on a piece of paper. That's it. There is no bylaw stating your grades must be submitted by a graduate student and no other, but if there were, it is the university that is enforcing the bylaw.
This narrative that grades can only be submitted by the TAs does not seem right, it seems like a narrative designed to put a wedge in the student body by spreading around a fundamental misunderstanding on how grading and graduation occurs at a university.
Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay
#149Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Name Calling I did not mean to come across this way or call you any names - can you point where I did so I won't repeat it? My skin is plenty thick, and this back and forth isn't meant to be whining. I'm just curious about your approach to this and it is fun to hear others perspectives, especially on such a polarizing topic. I'm a little perplexed on this reply to be honest. How is this constructive? I'm open to he…
I'm the lead moderator here. Your comments are fine, you didn't call names, and you're welcome here. I hope you'll continue to particpate!
Thank you! Been a lurker for a long time now at the suggestion of a coworker. I felt like a could contribute a different perspective in this thread so I made the account. Appreciate the work you do moderating!
Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay
#150I see a lot of discussion about the consequences of TAs withholding grades. This situation is a consequence of poor management at UCSC. Every other university I'm familiar with makes faculty responsible for submitting grades. It's inconceivable to me why TAs would be responsible for grades. TAs should be teaching assistants, not adjunct faculty. Edit: I read "assigning grades" to mean assigning the final grades for t…
Strange. every university im familiar with has grad students teaching courses, not just TAing. i did it myself.