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ThinkPad T480 is my new main laptop which runs FreeBSD

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Re: ThinkPad T480 is my new main laptop which runs FreeBSD

#141

Post by GordonS »

pjmlp wrote: post #133
GordonS wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Now it's one of the mainstream OSes ...on servers. It's still far, far from "mainstream" for desktops. Still, that's a really big deal. I work for what is firmly a Microsoft shop, and nobody bat's an eyelid now if we use Linux VMs (as long as they're cloud-based). I think 3 things in particular have driven the rise of Linux as a mainstream server OS: 1. docker/containerisation. Sure, Windows containers exist, but h…

> 1. docker/containerisation. Sure, Windows containers exist, but have you ever seen one in the wild? I have. What is done on .NET stays on Windows, for UNIX like OSes we get to use Java. Yes there is .NET Core, it is the future, not all MS shops are buying into it due to the current limitations, waiting to see how .NET 5 will actually look like.

I'm truly surprised you've seen Windows containers in the wild - across dozens of engagements with very firm Microsoft shops, I've never seen them, nor seen the need. Gods, even MSSQL runs on Linux these days!

I'm also very surprised you'd claim that not all Microsoft shops are buying into dotnet core - I've seen the very opposite; every client I've worked with has known dotnet framework has been superceded by core, and has been eager to move. A decent portion of this is driven by certain containerisation, which (realistically) means dotnet on Linux.

The only real limitation with dotnet core has been the lack of managed C++ support - a niche use case, and only relevant on Windows, but even this has been resolved in dotnet core 3.1.

Considering the not insubstantial performance improvements in dotnet core, and of course the benefit of cross-platform code, I'm really interested to hear about the limitations of dotnet core you've found (the switch for me and all the enterprise clients I've worked with has been great)?

Re: ThinkPad T480 is my new main laptop which runs FreeBSD

#142

Post by Rapzid »

bjornjajajaja wrote: post #117
loeg wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Time, resources, interest; lack of open datasheets and corporate sponsorship from the hardware vendors making the parts. These things don't just happen magically; people make them happen. Linux finally has enough market power that vendors willingly write drivers for it, but I remember a very similar situation with Linux in the 2000s when Microsoft was the only player around with that kind of market clout.

Also, who really NEEDS 802.11 ac?? If you’re that picky wtf not plug into Ethernet??

Heh, I actually spent nearly a whole day's time trying to figure out why I couldn't get more than ~300Mbps to my desktop from my Nighthawk AP via my Nighthawk USB wifi adapter. On Windows 10 Pro.

There is now an ethernet cable running across my living room.

Re: ThinkPad T480 is my new main laptop which runs FreeBSD

#143

Post by nine_k »

drewbug wrote: post #116
nh2 wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Stardate 2020. There is a mainstream OS with great driver support and the best gaming performance, that everybody uses (Linux). There are two other OSs battling for survival: One run by open source fanatics that release open source editors, browsers and programming languages and which frantically tries to emulate the mainstream OS (WSL), and one where stuff constantly breaks on upgrades, fundamental hardware like ke…

open source browsers?

They joined the Chromium project.

Re: ThinkPad T480 is my new main laptop which runs FreeBSD

#144

Post by School-Cotton »

loeg wrote: post #140
travbrack wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because running freebsd on a laptop is an edge case. Most people run it on servers. It’s not trying to be everything to everyone like Linux is.

FreeBSD dev here — I don't like this line of argument. It is always used to rationalize any defect in FreeBSD. Sometimes we just have defects! That's just the truth of things; we don't need to pretend we're defective on purpose . Many developers run FreeBSD on their daily driver laptops or workstations because it is (perhaps tautologically) one of the best platforms to develop FreeBSD on. Our wifi support isn't 100%…

I don't think the person you responded to was claiming or implying that FreeBSD's wifi support is incomplete on purpose. Rather giving a reason for why resources have not (yet?) been expended in that area.

I have FreeBSD running on my home desktop workstation and everything is working fine, but I wouldn't try to install it on my laptop. Laptop hardware is just too variable and non-standard. Touchscreens, esoteric Wi-Fi chipsets, fingerprint readers, brightness controls, bluetooth, power management, suspend on lid close... I'd be quite surprised if FreeBSD supported all of this out of the box, so I stick with Ubuntu.

Re: ThinkPad T480 is my new main laptop which runs FreeBSD

#145

Post by School-Cotton »

bayindirh wrote: post #8
PrimeDirective wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because you like the tinkering and believe there should be (fringe) alternatives to mainstream OSes?

> ...mainstream OSes? Look how far we've come. Linux was the alternative OS just ~15 years ago. Now it's one of the mainstream OSes . TBH, I'd like to see one of the BSDs to become one of the mainstream OSes too. :) edit: Except macOS ofc. :)

BSD was mainstream before Linux existed...

(and macOS can't really be called a BSD derivative; it is a mostly different OS that has taken some of its code from FreeBSD)

Re: ThinkPad T480 is my new main laptop which runs FreeBSD

#147

Post by temptemptemp111 »

namirez wrote: post #3

The other good development with Thinkpads is the introduction of AMD processors in their mainstream offerings (T495, T495s, X395, etc.). Unfortunately their screens suck though.

We need to put pressure on them. Hopefully next time it is AMD + top end OLED.

Re: ThinkPad T480 is my new main laptop which runs FreeBSD

#148

Post by temptemptemp111 »

morpheuskafka wrote: post #88
zelly wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a T495. I highly recommend it. Be warned, the keyboard is a chiclet keyboard, not the traditional Thinkpad keyboard. But having an AMD GPU and an AMD CPU automatically makes this my choice after having dealt with the horrors of NVIDIA on Linux.

The traditional ThinkPad keyboards are long gone (save for the T25 anniversary model). That said, they are still better than most other laptop keyboards I've tried.

They could easily bring them back... Let's keep making noise. Next Thinkpad model FTW (I'm trying to manifest it!)

Re: ThinkPad T480 is my new main laptop which runs FreeBSD

#149

Post by School-Cotton »

sien wrote: post #115
zelly wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of them use Macs and work on FreeBSD in a VM (I'm not kidding)

It'd be really interesting to know the proportion of Linux users who are now running under a VM for their desktop Linux use. I have Linux on the three machines I use. But on each it's via a VM. I run Windows and MacOS on the machines. Where I work this is common as well. It's surely pretty prevalent. The other way a lot of people work on Linux where I work is on a VM on AWS.

Raises hand.

I'm typing this from an Arch instance running in VMWare Fusion on a macOS host. It's a bit annoying though -- the trackpad is emulated as a scroll wheel, making everything janky, and I can't use my host's full 32gb of RAM...

I almost never do anything but run VMWare on the host -- the only reason I haven't given back my MBP and asked work to buy me a Linux machine is because I'm waiting for the 32gb Dell XPS 13 to come out, supposedly sometime this month.

Re: ThinkPad T480 is my new main laptop which runs FreeBSD

#150

Post by School-Cotton »

emaste wrote: post #105
namirez wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FreeBSD developers and people who use FreeBSD on a daily basis need laptops too. There are not many options out there unless they opt for ancient hardware.

I've got a Lenovo X1 Carbon 7th gen for FreeBSD development; there are many options besides ancient hardware. Buying a non-name $200 laptop isn't likely to result in a good experience, but if you're willing to do a little research there are many good options.

Any hardware not work on that one, that you know of?
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