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Finland is the only EU country where homelessness is in decline

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Re: Finland is the only EU country where homelessness is in decline

#141

Post by throwlaplace »

wolco wrote: post #140
throwlaplace wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The same conditions do not exist in the US. literally false according to the stats i posted that you didn't read (or discounted). >How progressive are we if we help ourselves / our families and people who are genetically like us but we don't provide the same support to other poorer nations. i don't understand? are you mad at finland for not being progressive enough? originally your point was the US couldn't be as pr…

An open immigration and generous foreign aid policy makes the US more progressive in some areas compared to Finland. No one is mad at Finland for not providing more external support. I hope my discussion points have caused you to open your mind around global progressive policy. It is never as simple as the headline seems. "Literally false according to the stats i posted that you didn't read (or discounted" Finland is…

>Finland is made up of one ethnic group, the US many. That link had no relation to my point.

here is what you wrote

>The homeless population in Finland is ethically and culturely similiar to the population which allows them to identify and provide support.

if you look at the statistics that i posted you see the the homeless population is primarily black people and white people which is ethnically and culturally similar to the population of the united states (note that black people doesn't mean recent african immigrants but american black people).

Re: Finland is the only EU country where homelessness is in decline

#142

Post by ixtli »

sjg007 wrote: post #14
ixtli wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If anything there should be a more broad term, something that includes people who are housing-unstable. I don't really consider the problem solved if a person worries every day that they might be homeless at the end of the next month!

The term you are looking for is "housing insecurity".

ah yes. i had kinda a 'brain fart' when i wrote this comment. i knew this phrase existed but couldn't remember!

Re: Finland is the only EU country where homelessness is in decline

#143

Post by RodgerTheGreat »

SamReidHughes wrote: post #127
ahelwer wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here, let me help you: try to imagine a society in which you want to live, not a random bunch of ideas like "taxation is theft at gunpoint" without regard to where that would lead.

A more just society, where if you choose not to work, you don’t eat.

Some people have inherited wealth, and choose not to work. Why do the circumstances of their birth make them entitled to a more comfortable life than anyone else? Luck isn't justice.

Some people are physically incapable of working. Would it be just for them to die?

Advances in automation continue to magnify the productivity of our workers. Many jobs have already been consigned to history forever with simple machines. One day, we may hardly need anyone to work at all to satisfy our consumption.

Our society already generates a surplus of all the necessities of life; there is no innate physical reason why it must be structured as a zero-sum game.

Re: Finland is the only EU country where homelessness is in decline

#144

Post by wolco »

throwlaplace wrote: post #141
wolco wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An open immigration and generous foreign aid policy makes the US more progressive in some areas compared to Finland. No one is mad at Finland for not providing more external support. I hope my discussion points have caused you to open your mind around global progressive policy. It is never as simple as the headline seems. "Literally false according to the stats i posted that you didn't read (or discounted" Finland is…

>Finland is made up of one ethnic group, the US many. That link had no relation to my point. here is what you wrote >The homeless population in Finland is ethically and culturely similiar to the population which allows them to identify and provide support. if you look at the statistics that i posted you see the the homeless population is primarily black people and white people which is ethnically and culturally simil…

Finland is made up of one population with similiar genes.

Primary white or black is not the same at all. The black population has very different genes within that subgroup representing 50+ countries with different histories some with salary others not. The white population is similiar but more diverse.

They are very different.

Re: Finland is the only EU country where homelessness is in decline

#145

Post by grawprog »

esotericn wrote: post #99
grawprog wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Does that mean that it's valid to label us both as "carless"? Sure....I don't own a car, I have zero issue with being labelled as carless. It's very much true. I lack a car, I am carless. My reason for lacking one may very well be different than yours, but the effects of not having cars are probably similar between us. Such as walking, biking or relying on public transit to travel, being limited on locations one can…

Right, but there's a huge distinction between having no car by choice, and having no car (particularly outside of metro areas), but really wanting one, because you can't afford it / have no licence / whatever. That's his point. I've been hitchhiking before and slept outside loads. It's not meaningful to call that 'homelessness'. Is a nomad homeless? Someone who simply falls behind on the rent and bounces around frien…

I never actually said which kind of carless person I am....it's not by choice. A label is just a way to describe something. People put far too much importance on the meaning behind labels these days. Labels don't have to be all encompassing and exclusive of other labels. They're just a convenient way of grouping and describing things with commonalities.

Calling someone carless or homeless has nothing to do with the reasoning behind it, it's a label for a current state. I agree, though, more fine grained labels should be used for tackling the causes behind these states. But calling someone homeless or carless isn't really offensive in and of itself.

Re: Finland is the only EU country where homelessness is in decline

#146

Post by SamReidHughes »

RodgerTheGreat wrote: post #143
SamReidHughes wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A more just society, where if you choose not to work, you don’t eat.

Some people have inherited wealth, and choose not to work. Why do the circumstances of their birth make them entitled to a more comfortable life than anyone else? Luck isn't justice. Some people are physically incapable of working. Would it be just for them to die? Advances in automation continue to magnify the productivity of our workers. Many jobs have already been consigned to history forever with simple machines.…

It's not structured as a zero-sum game.

Unless you take money from some people and give it to people who don't feel like working. That would be zero-sum.

Re: Finland is the only EU country where homelessness is in decline

#147

Post by Gravityloss »

gamblor956 wrote: post #97
Gravityloss wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There was a massive change from institutional care to ambulatory care at the start of the 90:s, coinciding with the severe recession. Basically a big resource cut. I don't think it was ever reversed. (Don't know much about the sector.)

Reagan was president in the early 1980s. The closure of most mental health facilities preceded the Bush recession.

I'm talking about Finland.

Re: Finland is the only EU country where homelessness is in decline

#148

Post by yokaze »

pavlov wrote: post #115
_jal wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have evidence that there's more friction/graft in the US than, say, Finland?

There's the established Corruption Perceptions Index published annually by Transparency International: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_Perceptions_Index Finland is ranked #3 while US is #22.

The keyword here is "perception". I am not convinced that the perception is deserved.

Re: Finland is the only EU country where homelessness is in decline

#149

Post by yokaze »

teekert wrote: post #100

I recently, with work, did a tour around Eindhoven (the Netherlands) together with Homeless people. I learned that one never has to be homeless in that city, there are many locations to get food, shelter and help. The homeless people on the streets have such severe ADHD that sleeping halls stress them out, or they have other mental issues, can't deal with authority, have a severe lack of trust or fear for the healthc…

From what I heard from a homeless person is, that the problem with the sleeping halls are other homeless people.

It would stress anyone out, if your "cohabitants" fecate in the shower, start screaming in the middle of the night, pose a risk of physical abuse, stealing, etc...

So, if you consider preferring not to live in such conditions a choice, then yes, it is impossible. But in my book, it is sounds rather like a choice of a healthy mind and not one a civilized wealthy society should put one up with.

Re: Finland is the only EU country where homelessness is in decline

#150

Post by gamblor956 »

okay_okay_ wrote: post #132
gamblor956 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is objectively false. Schizoaffective disorders, bipolar disorder, and most other serious mental illnesses are not treated with diet and exercise, nor is bad diet or poor exercise the cause of serious mental illnesses.

I said CAN be treated. Whether or not mental illnesses are COMMONLY treated that way is another argument. It is a fact that all serious mental illnesses are greatly influenced by diet and exercise, including Schizoaffective disorders and bipolar disorder

And I'm telling you it is literally not a fact that serious mental disorders can be treated with don't and exercise.
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