Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Julian Assange “slowly dying” and “often sedated” in Belmarsh prison

wsws.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

141–150 of 321 posts

Re: Julian Assange “slowly dying” and “often sedated” in Belmarsh prison

#141

Post by [deleted] »

foldr wrote: post #139
prepend wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So if I buy something from a Saudi Arabian e-commerce site am I at risk for extradition from Ireland to Saudi Arabia for the capital offense of being gay? Clearly I was gay while doing stuff online on a Saudi Arabian server.

No, you couldn't be extradited from Ireland for being gay because it's not illegal to be gay in Ireland. It has to be a crime in both countries. But in general, questions of jurisdiction are complicated. They're settled by courts, not by what people say on the internet.

[deleted]

Re: Julian Assange “slowly dying” and “often sedated” in Belmarsh prison

#142

Post by malvosenior »

spaced-out wrote: post #127
corporate_shi11 wrote: post #107

I was part of a news and current events Facebook group a few years ago, when WikiLeaks was primarily known for leaking evidence of the US Military's abuses in the middle East. Most of the people in this group were Democrats or otherwise on the Left. They cheered WikiLeaks and loved that it was exposing the abuses of a group they didn't like. Fast forward to 2016, and WikiLeaks begins publishing damaging information r…

The reason many people turned on Wikileaks was because he clearly sided with Trump in 2016. He released the info he had on Hillary to damage her campaign, even though it didn't show anything illegal, yet he refused to publish the documents he had on Trump. People sided with him because they believed he was impartial, and turned away from him when it was clear he wasn't.

> People sided with him because they believed he was impartial, and turned away from him when it was clear he wasn't.

He literally provided evidence of mainstream media being highly impartial in favor of Clinton (against Sanders and Trump). If people cared about impartiality, they’d be on Wikileaks side here.

Re: Julian Assange “slowly dying” and “often sedated” in Belmarsh prison

#143

Post by shkkmo »

tptacek wrote: post #88
Synaesthesia wrote: post #82

Wikileaks has a faultless record. They’ve never had to retract a publication. Assange, like him not not, was a reporter, who reported uncomfortable facts about the military and our ruling class. He is being punished, tortured really for this “crime”. He has been endlessly and baselessly slandered. All that alleged bad behaviour while he was imprisoned in the embassy ... funny how there’s been no footage of it, despit…

Wikileaks does not have a faultless record. For example: http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2016/07/why-did-wikileaks-hel...

I think misrepresenting the contents in a dump in such a way as happened here would qualify as something worthy of a retraction.

Re: Julian Assange “slowly dying” and “often sedated” in Belmarsh prison

#144

Post by jasonvorhe »

jacobush wrote: post #97
Synaesthesia wrote: post #82

Wikileaks has a faultless record. They’ve never had to retract a publication. Assange, like him not not, was a reporter, who reported uncomfortable facts about the military and our ruling class. He is being punished, tortured really for this “crime”. He has been endlessly and baselessly slandered. All that alleged bad behaviour while he was imprisoned in the embassy ... funny how there’s been no footage of it, despit…

We need to be very exact in these matters. The problem with the rape charges is that very, very likely he would have been convicted under Swedish law, which is very strict on what counts as rape. (If proof could be produced.) What is a farce is how the case went on and on, and how the plaintiffs didn't even seem to want to hang on the to case, and how a crime which is routinely buried in cold cases by Swedish Police…

Going on the record of being a victim of sexual abuse isn't easy and being subject to harassment by the press, WL zealots and other loonies could've just been enough to warrant that the victims no longer cared enough about justice. They've both been on the record saying that they only wanted to pressure Assange to get tested for STDs since he forced himself on them without protection. I assume they didn't want this to blow up the way it did.

Re: Julian Assange “slowly dying” and “often sedated” in Belmarsh prison

#145

Post by samatman »

INGELRII wrote: post #91
samatman wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Civil disobedience is breaking a law because you believe the law itself is wrong. As invented by Thoreau, and practiced by Gandhi and MLK. Breaking a law you otherwise believe in, in the service of some broader goal, is called direct action, riot, or terrorism, depending on the severity of the law broken, and/or the sympathies of the person describing it.

In both cases, if you believe in society based on laws, what I said stands. Agreed?

I was speaking to your first point, namely:

> Sometimes individuals must break the law for greater good. This is called civil disobedience, or civil resistance.

Which is not a complete description of civil disobedience. It is accurate, but not precise.

Civil disobedience implies the actor wishes the law to be changed. They might expect not just a pardon for themselves, but a pardon for everyone who broke the unjust law. It's a distinction with a difference.

We agree that its effectiveness depends on accepting the punishment, sure.

Re: Julian Assange “slowly dying” and “often sedated” in Belmarsh prison

#146

Post by tehjoker »

moksly wrote: post #10

Why is the WikiLeaks foundation responsible for the content posted on their platform, when Google and Facebook aren’t? I haven’t really been following this a whole lot, but as I understand it, the US wants him extradited because his platform was used to leak sensible information that put American soldiers in danger. But why is that a thing when it isn’t for other platforms? I mean, twitter, Facebook and YouTube have…

Wikileaks is an effective critic of US foreign policy that cannot be controlled by the usual means. YouTube 's executives are much more friendly to US government interests.

Re: Julian Assange “slowly dying” and “often sedated” in Belmarsh prison

#147

Post by toomanybeersies »

prepend wrote: post #117
threeseed wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not how the entire fabric of international law works though. Citizenship and postal address are irrelevant. If you break the law in another country and there is an extradition treaty then you will face the consequences.

So if I buy something from a Saudi Arabian e-commerce site am I at risk for extradition from Ireland to Saudi Arabia for the capital offense of being gay? Clearly I was gay while doing stuff online on a Saudi Arabian server.

Specifically, for your case, I'd say no [1]

> The Justice Minister has, however, told the Dáil that he won’t extradite anyone who may be put to death for their crime.

More generally, you're at risk of extradition if the alleged crime is also a crime in the country you reside in [2].

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_criminality

Re: Julian Assange “slowly dying” and “often sedated” in Belmarsh prison

#148

Post by shkkmo »

aNoob7000 wrote: post #53
sneak wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am pretty sure the main issue here is that someone who has not been put on trial yet is being tortured to death.

He could have walked out of the Ecuador embassy in England and gone to court; instead, he chose to wait for seven years in the hopes of waiting it out. I have zero sympathies for the guy. His intentions might have been honorable, but when you play with fire, you are bound to get burned.

Seeking asylum in the Ecuadorian embassy justifies torture how?

Re: Julian Assange “slowly dying” and “often sedated” in Belmarsh prison

#149

Post by JoeSmithson »

yk wrote: post #76
rbobby wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Assange doesn't qualify for bail (he is a flight risk/certainty) so he stays in custody until the hearings are done. Made his bed and now has to lie in it.

Having him 23 h a day in solitary confinement and not allowing him to call his mom seems a bit harsh, if they are concerned that he's a flight risk.

There is no evidence that Assange is being held in solitary confinement, in fact it has been explicitly denied by his UN supporter[0].

> "...although Assange was not being held in solitary confinement at HMP Belmarsh..."

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/julian-assan...

Re: Julian Assange “slowly dying” and “often sedated” in Belmarsh prison

#150

Post by foldr »

MiroF wrote: post #125
foldr wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It's not and the vast vast majority of those sentenced to under a year (even for skipping bail) are released in 2/3 time as per sentencing guidelines in the UK. He's already served his time. He's currently being detained prior to his extradition hearing: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-49689167

Exactly - so he is in jail for crimes he has not yet been tried for. That was the exact point that the user sneak above was making.

>Exactly - so he is in jail for crimes he has not yet been tried for.

This is what happens to anyone who isn’t granted bail. Unless you are granted bail, you are kept in custody in the period between being charged with a crime and being tried for it.

As I mentioned above, it’s not difficult to see why Assange has not been granted bail in this instance. In fact, he didn’t even apply for bail.

Post reply on HN