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U.S. drone strike kills 30 pine nut farm workers in Afghanistan

reuters.com

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Re: U.S. drone strike kills 30 pine nut farm workers in Afghanistan

#141

Post by hevi_jos »

concordDance wrote: post #30

Not that this isn't a tragedy (and/or mass murder depending on your viewpoint), but I don't think hackernews is the right venue for this. Hackernews should try and keep to tech and away from politics or its quality will continue to degrade. For instance the comments here are mostly not saying anything that hasn't already been said a thousand times before (is this just outrage porn?).

Why not?

Technology has consequences that are ethical issues because it has influence on the lives of real people.

If you create a technology that is used to abuse other people(like facebook spying or manipulating masses or the military invading other countries), you are responsible for it.

The quality of HN improves if the human side of technology and science is openly discussed.

If a drone kills 30 people it is not "porn". It is a very serious matter.

Would you call it outrage porn if those 30 people were from your family?

Re: U.S. drone strike kills 30 pine nut farm workers in Afghanistan

#142

Post by brosinante »

whiddershins wrote: post #126
wruza wrote: post #2

Now imagine “U.S. drone strike kills 30 pine nut farm workers in France” and feel the difference (which is non-existent). Then it goes on tv and reads the list of this morning’s evil men who must be stopped.

Now imagine “France knowingly harbors 911 terrorists.” “French leaders take credit for car bombing which kills 23 civilians.” There’s a historical reason for this discrepancy.

The US "knowingly harbored" nazi war criminals.

Re: U.S. drone strike kills 30 pine nut farm workers in Afghanistan

#143

Post by alpb »

whiddershins wrote: post #122
alpb wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is how you create terrorists. Um no, you are wrong. _What USA does_ is terrorism. When you drop bombs on people out of nowhere, that's called terrorism. Sorry if you're an American but you've got some learning to do about the biggest terrorist organization in the world before calling others a terrorist. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vRbnPA3fd5U

Just stop. Absolutely stop equating these things. The world as we know it, the progress in art, science, and humanities. The cures for polio, infant mortality and poverty dropping. The website you are currently using to spread poison. Those are all “_What USA does_” Cut it out with this evil language.

I think the downvotes you got speak for itself. I am not even gonna bother answering.

Also USA has some of the highest infant mortality and poverty rates in the western world.

Re: U.S. drone strike kills 30 pine nut farm workers in Afghanistan

#144

Post by bakuninsbart »

black_puppydog wrote: post #40
newguy1234 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also stories like this will be passed down for generations to recruit new jihadists/terrorists. They use this stuff as proof that the USA is anti-muslim or to prove that there is a war against muslims going on. You simply cannot bomb your way out of resolving the terrorism issue. This will probably have the same effectiveness as the war on drugs: lots of money spent....little to no impact on drug smuggling/drug abuse…

> They use this stuff as proof that the USA is anti-muslim or to prove that there is a war against muslims going on. And the worst thing is: from a policy perspective (obviously not arguing about every single US citizen) that's really hard to argue with, given which countries the US has entered into armed conflicts with, which groups of people are most picked upon by politicians, etc.

Luckily (for muslims), the focus of racism is slowly changing to Chinese people now. It is as if Americans (and most others) can't exist without an ethnicity to be mad about.

Re: U.S. drone strike kills 30 pine nut farm workers in Afghanistan

#145

Post by TeMPOraL »

whiddershins wrote: post #134
TeMPOraL wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And does it go the other way? Do you create violent anti-Islamists when Muslims commit terror attacks? Were the orphans of 9/11 more likely to sign up for the US military, or commit hate crimes against Muslims than their non-directly-affected peers? Yes, of course it does. Hell, even on the recent 9/11 HN thread there were people who said they joined the military after the towers collapsed. It's only natural reacti…

It’s just not a loop. Jihadists aren’t in a loop. That’s a myth. Jihad is real to them, and they are attacking non believers. The stated motivation for the 9/11 attacks were the presence of U.S. airbases in Saudi Arabia. Not revenge for some past hurt or attack. Why does everyone presume that what they say isn’t what they mean?

Oh they are in the loop, even if they don't see it.

This is how religion is used to get people to do things. You can read anything you like from a religious book; you'll find justification for anything if you comb for quotes enough. This makes religion a glue, or an amplifier, not a prescriber of behavior.

Consider Christianity - the religion that gave us half of what's nice about the Western culture. That same religion using that same, unchanging book, set half of Europe aflame multiple times, for ostensibly religious reasons. When you look at it from outside it looks ridiculous, and when you study history you discover obvious political goals behind the crusades and other European wars - but then, a lot of people fighting and directing forces believed they do it because "God commands it".

It's no different with Islam. Jihad is just an excuse to get people to fight and die for political causes. If the political reasons disappear, they'll soon find an excuse to not fight, and Jihad will again become "the internal struggle".

Re: U.S. drone strike kills 30 pine nut farm workers in Afghanistan

#146

Post by misja »

lopmotr wrote: post #140
misja wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Genuine question: if the motivation for this bombing was not political or ideological, what was it then?

I think terrorism is killing random members of a population to scare the others into some political or ideological change. It wouldn't count if it was targeted at fighters and civilians got killed by accident.

That sounds like a reasonable definition. But how would this definition qualify the Taliban attacks on military bases and police stations in Afghanistan?

Re: U.S. drone strike kills 30 pine nut farm workers in Afghanistan

#147

Post by mseidl »

newguy1234 wrote: post #24
gcatalfamo wrote: post #14

This is how you create terrorists. What do you think the children and friends feelings towards the US will be from now on? People get radicalized for much less than that.

Also stories like this will be passed down for generations to recruit new jihadists/terrorists. They use this stuff as proof that the USA is anti-muslim or to prove that there is a war against muslims going on. You simply cannot bomb your way out of resolving the terrorism issue. This will probably have the same effectiveness as the war on drugs: lots of money spent....little to no impact on drug smuggling/drug abuse…

Don't forget when Trump said killing terrorists families, really shortly after the clips were in terrorist recruitment videos.

Re: U.S. drone strike kills 30 pine nut farm workers in Afghanistan

#148

Post by alpaca128 »

mieseratte wrote: post #100
wruza wrote: post #2

Now imagine “U.S. drone strike kills 30 pine nut farm workers in France” and feel the difference (which is non-existent). Then it goes on tv and reads the list of this morning’s evil men who must be stopped.

As much as I would love the US out of Afghanistan, there’s a war on over there. Yours is a disingenuous comparison.

A war where the US were totally forced to participate, of course, like always...

Re: U.S. drone strike kills 30 pine nut farm workers in Afghanistan

#149

Post by rat9988 »

whiddershins wrote: post #134
TeMPOraL wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And does it go the other way? Do you create violent anti-Islamists when Muslims commit terror attacks? Were the orphans of 9/11 more likely to sign up for the US military, or commit hate crimes against Muslims than their non-directly-affected peers? Yes, of course it does. Hell, even on the recent 9/11 HN thread there were people who said they joined the military after the towers collapsed. It's only natural reacti…

It’s just not a loop. Jihadists aren’t in a loop. That’s a myth. Jihad is real to them, and they are attacking non believers. The stated motivation for the 9/11 attacks were the presence of U.S. airbases in Saudi Arabia. Not revenge for some past hurt or attack. Why does everyone presume that what they say isn’t what they mean?

Someone else in this thread posted this [0]. They don't say what you tell us they say.

[0] https://www.theguardian.com/world/2002/nov/24/theobserver

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