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What Happens When You ACH a Dead Person?

moderntreasury.com

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Re: What Happens When You ACH a Dead Person?

#141

Post by emiliobumachar »

falsedan wrote: post #135
emiliobumachar wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry if I'm out-of-date, but how do checks work online?

Like, to pay for something remotely? I’ve emailed a picture of the check to sellers who refuse to use PayPal and then they use their bank’s online deposit system to drop it into their account (a couple of times for second-hand board games).

Thanks for the reply. But, that sounded very unsecure. What happens if a third party cashes it first, you say you didn't share the picture, the merchant says they didn't share the picture?

Re: What Happens When You ACH a Dead Person?

#142

Post by edubs25 »

colejohnson66 wrote: post #115
coldpie wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I started renting a studio a couple months back. They gave the option to pay with a paper check or with a credit/debit card online. Online transaction came with a $20/statement "convenience fee". Meanwhile a mailed paper check is $0.50 including postage. Paper check it is.

I never understood this logic. We’ll hand process your check for free, but if you want to use this website we set up, it’ll be a $20 “convenience fee.” I get passing the debit/credit fee onto the consumer, but it’s there even when I were to choose ACH.

Probably because the party doing the ACH is a third party agent/ISO but the checks are probably cashed directly by the management company. The thing that your management company probably wont tell you is they get some kick back on the profits from those fees you're being charged. So not only do they get your rent money but they also make money on you using electronic payments.

Re: What Happens When You ACH a Dead Person?

#143

Post by js2 »

pbreit wrote: post #94
js2 wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's same day ACH, but I have no idea how widespread it is yet: https://www.nacha.org/same-day-ach-resource-center Anecdotally, I recently moved my banking to a discount broker and my paycheck is now credited to my account the night before. I don't know if that has anything to do with same-day ACH. Also anecdotally, Ally takes 5 business days (!) to open a CD via ACH even for an already verified bank. Definitely f…

Businesses use ACH extensively to pay each other same-day (and debit consumer bank accounts). But it has never caught on for consumer "push" payments.

Is pull a totally different process? I’ve noticed for pull you have to authenticate the account (usually) with the “verify the two small deposits” dance while push will sometimes let you skip that.

In fact, I just called Citi earlier today because I’d closed a CC with them and had a credit. The CS rep asked for my routing and acct number and without even verifying it with me immediately said “you’ll see the credit in a couple days.” I asked her to verify the account number and she said “I’m sorry but the number is no longer visible to me but rest assured I sent it to the correct account.” So if those funds went somewhere else I suppose I’ll never see them?

I was also able to establish the ability to wire from my discount broker today to another checking account I have without performing any verification of the destination beyond providing the routing/acct number.

I have a feeling I actually don’t want to know how this all works...

Re: What Happens When You ACH a Dead Person?

#144

Post by souterrain »

djsumdog wrote: post #60
thro_away_n wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this the same thing as Zelle?

I don't think Zelle is real time. I'm curious if it's the same working group for RTP that was behind Zelle.

The times I’ve used Zelle to send money, it has been real-time.

Re: What Happens When You ACH a Dead Person?

#145

Post by Qworg »

djsumdog wrote: post #60
thro_away_n wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this the same thing as Zelle?

I don't think Zelle is real time. I'm curious if it's the same working group for RTP that was behind Zelle.

Zelle is roughly real time.

It is owned by the same company doing RTP.

Re: What Happens When You ACH a Dead Person?

#146

Post by xur17 »

souterrain wrote: post #144
djsumdog wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think Zelle is real time. I'm curious if it's the same working group for RTP that was behind Zelle.

The times I’ve used Zelle to send money, it has been real-time.

Once I've sent money to someone a few times it's typically instant, but it isn't always.

Re: What Happens When You ACH a Dead Person?

#147

Post by Tuna-Fish »

reaperducer wrote: post #51
grecy wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Moving from Australia to Canada/US felt like going back in time 20 years when it came to banking. Even ten years ago in Australia I could do more with my online banking than I can today in North America. Checks are for what now?

Checks are for what now? For me this week: Paid for a city license, paid the cat sitter, paid for a small magazine subscription, made a charitable donation, and paid the rent. The cat sitter and the charity were check only. No other option. The magazine has a PayPal option, but I don't trust PayPal. The city license could have been done with a card online, but I'm not interested in setting up yet another account with…

What I don't really get is why American payment systems insist on including some way to pull money out of an account, which therefore requires massive amounts of trust.

The way the European system works is that there is one possible operation; the owner of an account can move money from their account to any other account.

If you want me to pay you rent, you provide me with a standard format bill, which includes your account number, the amount, the date to pay by, and an optional reference number (for use of the recipient to tell what I was paying for). To pay, I input those into my banking app (or more likely, read the barcode on the bill with my phone), verify that everything is correct, and press a button to transfer funds.

The point is, I don't have to trust you to do any of the banking right. I have paper trail from you in form of the bill you provided (which confirms that the numbers I used are correct), and from my bank that the transfer was initiated on a given day at a given time. There cannot be any error that I didn't make.

Re: What Happens When You ACH a Dead Person?

#148

Post by kube-system »

itcrowd wrote: post #12

This reminds me of a question I've had for the longest time (+): why is it that in the US wiring money between accounts is so expensive or difficult? Whole ecosystems of companies have sprung up (PayPal and Stripe come to mind, and apps such as TransferWise) to reduce the friction when the banks could easily set up a way cheaper system that would actually be better (privacy etc.) for the consumer. The EU seems to be…

I wonder what happens when you Venmo a dead person.

Given other stories I've heard about the difficulty of resolving problematic payments over Venmo with no recourse, I bet they don't have much of a robust system in place for resolving that either.

Banking controls are expensive. It's cheap when you simply don't have them.

Re: What Happens When You ACH a Dead Person?

#149

Post by evgen »

vageli wrote: post #139
pbreit wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Secure enough to process $50 trillion in 2018.

> Secure enough to process $50 trillion in 2018. How is that any indication of its security?

It is an existence proof that the security is good enough to get the job done and keep losses to an acceptable level. If it was truly "woeful" enough to actually matter then an alternative with better security would have displaced it by now.

Re: What Happens When You ACH a Dead Person?

#150

Post by NewsAware »

vageli wrote: post #139
pbreit wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Secure enough to process $50 trillion in 2018.

> Secure enough to process $50 trillion in 2018. How is that any indication of its security?

It is a high indication of many people considering it secure enough (for their respective business case)
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