A Learning Secret: Don't Take Notes with a Laptop (2014) • Hacker News Board

Re: A Learning Secret: Don't Take Notes with a Laptop (2014)

#141

Post by linker3000 » Tue, Jun 25, 2019, 11:35 AM UTC

seventhtiger wrote: post #137

3jckd wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can subscribe to this. Whenever I needed to learn or revise something, I would just write it down again, usually paraphrasing the original material. While I wouldn't use that material directly ever again, I noticed that I would often paraphrase a paraphrase, so to speak, because I would remember some of the material. Tangentially, this thread shows that people prefer different ways of taking (or not taking notes) u…

Although I must admit that most classmates find it horrific ("you're throwing away all the notes?!") so there must he some personal differences, I can honestly say I have never seen anyone learn from laid back magazine reading so many students do, that glazed over look while they try to mechanically reach the last page. Same goes for listening or watching or any other passive reception of material. Learning is a func…

Absolutely - at the end of the day, it's "whatever works for you" in the context of personal learning/accreditation.

Re: A Learning Secret: Don't Take Notes with a Laptop (2014)

#142

Post by danielecook » Tue, Jun 25, 2019, 11:35 AM UTC

seventhtiger wrote: post #116

I tended to be in the top of the classes I was in and as far as I've seen my method was somewhat different. I also only take notes on paper, but more importantly, I throw all my notes out as soon as I finish writing them. For me studying is the act of writing the notes. The purpose of notes was never to read them later. That's why writing on paper is important to me. It's not about the qualities and convenience of th…

I take great satisfaction in filling a notebook from cover to cover though. I do look back at old notes, although it is quite rare.

Re: A Learning Secret: Don't Take Notes with a Laptop (2014)

#143

Post by linker3000 » Tue, Jun 25, 2019, 11:39 AM UTC

martin_a wrote: post #134

linker3000 wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, but in the UK they are stupidly expensive - I thought about buying Cornell notebooks for the team (or having company ones made up), but soon changed my mind.

Did you have a look at the big online printers in the EU area? I would throw Flyeralarm in the ring (not connected to them), looks like you can get a Wire-O notebook with 50 pages, and cover artwork as you like, for around 3 Euro (at 50 pieces) with prices dropping from there on. Or what price do you think of?

Thanks - that's interesting.

I checked Amazon (yeah, OK) and a few commercial printers that specifically mentioned Cornell notebooks.

I may have to revisit this matter.

Re: A Learning Secret: Don't Take Notes with a Laptop (2014)

#144

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Jun 25, 2019, 11:40 AM UTC

seventhtiger wrote: post #116

I tended to be in the top of the classes I was in and as far as I've seen my method was somewhat different. I also only take notes on paper, but more importantly, I throw all my notes out as soon as I finish writing them. For me studying is the act of writing the notes. The purpose of notes was never to read them later. That's why writing on paper is important to me. It's not about the qualities and convenience of th…

[deleted]

Re: A Learning Secret: Don't Take Notes with a Laptop (2014)

#145

Post by windexh8er » Tue, Jun 25, 2019, 11:43 AM UTC

seventhtiger wrote: post #137

3jckd wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can subscribe to this. Whenever I needed to learn or revise something, I would just write it down again, usually paraphrasing the original material. While I wouldn't use that material directly ever again, I noticed that I would often paraphrase a paraphrase, so to speak, because I would remember some of the material. Tangentially, this thread shows that people prefer different ways of taking (or not taking notes) u…

Although I must admit that most classmates find it horrific ("you're throwing away all the notes?!") so there must he some personal differences, I can honestly say I have never seen anyone learn from laid back magazine reading so many students do, that glazed over look while they try to mechanically reach the last page. Same goes for listening or watching or any other passive reception of material. Learning is a func…

Do you feel that had you taken notes on an eReader / iPad with a pen input you would have similar effectiveness? I used to take notes for work in a small pad and found I didn't reference them often. I've recently tried moving to digital notes and there seems to be little friction to the switch with the exception of additional distraction (ie all those other apps).

Re: A Learning Secret: Don't Take Notes with a Laptop (2014)

#146

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Jun 25, 2019, 11:55 AM UTC

thom wrote: post #112

sjogress wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Personally, I'm far too undisciplined to enforce such rules on a tablet, so I got a Remarkable instead. Essentially an e-ink reader with handwriting capabilities.

This is an interesting device, but watching the video the lag seems very unsatisfying - is that an issue in general use?

[deleted]

Re: A Learning Secret: Don't Take Notes with a Laptop (2014)

#147

Post by sklivvz1971 » Tue, Jun 25, 2019, 11:55 AM UTC

Pro-tip: if you are like me, never take note and divert all your attention to the lesson.

Getting copies of notes or reading the actual book can easily replace any note taking. Being distracted from the actual explanation because I'm using my attention to write, is a net loss.

Re: A Learning Secret: Don't Take Notes with a Laptop (2014)

#148

Post by RegBarclay » Tue, Jun 25, 2019, 12:01 PM UTC

bayesian_horse wrote: post #34

In lectures, note-taking at all should be avoided, most of the time. Most lectures cover material that is presented very clearly in accompanying materials, books or the internet. The idea I could do a better job than those authors while listening to the stuff for the first time is ludicrous. And at least for me it doesn't help recollection or focus to write notes while listening, and many students report they can tak…

I tend to agree in general. I found that actively listening and paying attention to a lecturer and maybe taking a few sparse notes on some key points or things emphasized by the speaker worked fine. I advised my kids as they went off to college that showing up and paying attention were the most important things they could do.

Re: A Learning Secret: Don't Take Notes with a Laptop (2014)

#149

Post by 3jckd » Tue, Jun 25, 2019, 12:05 PM UTC

windexh8er wrote: post #145

seventhtiger wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Although I must admit that most classmates find it horrific ("you're throwing away all the notes?!") so there must he some personal differences, I can honestly say I have never seen anyone learn from laid back magazine reading so many students do, that glazed over look while they try to mechanically reach the last page. Same goes for listening or watching or any other passive reception of material. Learning is a func…

Do you feel that had you taken notes on an eReader / iPad with a pen input you would have similar effectiveness? I used to take notes for work in a small pad and found I didn't reference them often. I've recently tried moving to digital notes and there seems to be little friction to the switch with the exception of additional distraction (ie all those other apps).

Not OP, but I ditched taking notes on paper for the most part. I write stuff down on the iPad Pro (Notes and/or Notability) instead nowadays. It is easier to find and extract things and I can just archive them to the cloud when they are not needed anymore.

The only time I use paper is when I don't have the iPad on me and for personal journaling (for which I have a dedicated notebook anyway).

Re: A Learning Secret: Don't Take Notes with a Laptop (2014)

#150

Post by brendyn » Tue, Jun 25, 2019, 12:09 PM UTC

seventhtiger wrote: post #137

3jckd wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can subscribe to this. Whenever I needed to learn or revise something, I would just write it down again, usually paraphrasing the original material. While I wouldn't use that material directly ever again, I noticed that I would often paraphrase a paraphrase, so to speak, because I would remember some of the material. Tangentially, this thread shows that people prefer different ways of taking (or not taking notes) u…

Although I must admit that most classmates find it horrific ("you're throwing away all the notes?!") so there must he some personal differences, I can honestly say I have never seen anyone learn from laid back magazine reading so many students do, that glazed over look while they try to mechanically reach the last page. Same goes for listening or watching or any other passive reception of material. Learning is a func…

I'm inclined to agree about reproducing knowledge, however I've spent the last few years learning languages and learning languages is the exact opposite, where the majority of learning is done through simply inputting language.

For example see Krashen's ideas on language acquisition https://www.sk.com.br/sk-krash.html

Now this makes me feel like I hold a contradiction because the way I think about learning a language and learning math are opposite in this way.

Do you or others have any thoughts on this matter? Is it because we evolved some tailored machinery for acquiring language naturally as children, or because they are learnt the same "way", it's just that language is generally just a tremendous amount of associating stuff that it requires 100x more consumption. I guess one could naturally acquire the times tables over time if all combinations of a*b up to 10 come up in conversation enough times, but a general procedure for doing multiplication wouldn't be acquired magically.