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Elixir 1.9

elixir-lang.org

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Re: Elixir 1.9

#141

Post by bitscrapper »

sansnomme wrote: post #132
nickjj wrote: post #39

If anyone is on the fence on learning Elixir / Phoenix (Elixir's most popular web framework library) please do yourself a favor and give it a shot. If you're on a time crunch and want the best bang for your buck on "why bother learning yet another language to write web apps in?" then watch this talk called "The Soul of Erlang and Elixir": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JvBT4XBdoUE I'm not affiliated with the languag…

The Authn/Authz story of Phoenix is a joke though compared to Rails/Devise or Django. The framework authors refuse to ship a first party implementation and instead leave it to the community. Problem is, the ones available are mostly extremely low level (ueberauth, guardian etc.) and you have to spend ages customizing it. On Rails it's literally two commands to set up user registration, email confirmation, password re…

As someone who used Devise multiple times and always ended up regretting said choice in the long term, I am actually glad there is no Devise for Phoenix.

In one day I can quickly get something up and running with Guardian and have full control over how my app does authentication. Password reset and confirmation are easily done with Phoenix.Token without a need to touch the database.

Also, authorisation is a breeze on Phoenix. Take a look at Canada: https://github.com/jarednorman/canada - and it is only 10 LOC.

Re: Elixir 1.9

#142

Post by rehemiau »

mars4rp wrote: post #69
nickjj wrote: post #39

If anyone is on the fence on learning Elixir / Phoenix (Elixir's most popular web framework library) please do yourself a favor and give it a shot. If you're on a time crunch and want the best bang for your buck on "why bother learning yet another language to write web apps in?" then watch this talk called "The Soul of Erlang and Elixir": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JvBT4XBdoUE I'm not affiliated with the languag…

I gave it a try, but for me after years of programming in C like languages the syntax is really hard. I know it is very similar to Ruby. I wish there was a ElixirC syntax that would also compile to Earlang.

It seems similar to Ruby, but in the end it's more like Prolog

Re: Elixir 1.9

#143

Post by cryptica »

brightball wrote: post #78
dmitriid wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For all that to work you will need: - to understand exactly what your app is doing - to understand exactly what Erlang/Elixir releases are doin - to understand exactly how cod upgrade works - to understand exactly or very damn well how to make the system handle those 1 million connections - to understand exactly how to handle all the things you wrote about And then, and only then will you be able to "think about bein…

Eh...it’s basically a 1 line command with distillery. Another for the rollback capability. It’s pretty magical. There’s a reason people love it. Certainly, don’t use it if you don’t need it...it introduces extra complexity...but if you do it’s really hard to beat.

Having to support two different versions of the Elixir service during the rollout period is risky...

What if something goes wrong during the rollout? For example, if you change the database schema or upgraded your database engine or changed your back end authentication approach, it can break the old code. Then how will you know whether it's a problem with the old code or new code if many nodes are running both?

Re: Elixir 1.9

#144

Post by dnautics »

59nadir wrote: post #137
ashton314 wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Erlang’s Dialyzer (and the related Elixir project Dialyxer) provide compile-time type safety analysis. It’s optional and only at compile time, but immensely helpful in verifying correctness.

dialyzer is terrible and doesn't actually work in practice, as is evidenced by the many dialyzer errors that slip through to current releases on hex of libraries even the size of Phoenix, StreamData, etc.... Even the major community members don't use it. It's not a substitute for a type system and especially not one that allows you to properly model things in it.

have you used it with elixir_ls? I find that in practice it catches about 80% of my errors before I send them to test.

Re: Elixir 1.9

#145

Post by pbowyer »

sansnomme wrote: post #132
nickjj wrote: post #39

If anyone is on the fence on learning Elixir / Phoenix (Elixir's most popular web framework library) please do yourself a favor and give it a shot. If you're on a time crunch and want the best bang for your buck on "why bother learning yet another language to write web apps in?" then watch this talk called "The Soul of Erlang and Elixir": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JvBT4XBdoUE I'm not affiliated with the languag…

The Authn/Authz story of Phoenix is a joke though compared to Rails/Devise or Django. The framework authors refuse to ship a first party implementation and instead leave it to the community. Problem is, the ones available are mostly extremely low level (ueberauth, guardian etc.) and you have to spend ages customizing it. On Rails it's literally two commands to set up user registration, email confirmation, password re…

> The Authn/Authz story of Phoenix is a joke though compared to Rails/Devise or Django. The framework authors refuse to ship a first party implementation and instead leave it to the community.

I agree, but it's not unique to Phoenix. In the PHP world the otherwise excellent Symfony framework is only starting to add generation of authentication/authorization, and email confirmation and password reset remains the developer's responsibility.

I see two reasons for this.

1. Frameworks see themselves as building blocks, not RAD systems. When the core framework developers are (mostly) working on APIs they don't see the need for approval/password reset. After all "you'll issue the user with a JWT so who cares about the rest (shrug)"

2. Flexibility to auth with anything. Apparently not bundling a system makes it more "flexible".

I believe (1) to (a) be shortsighted and (b) we need RAD frameworks, of higher-level flexible components that can be bolted together.

I believe (2) is wrong, and bundling standard auth flows does not reduce flexibility: you implement your own if you need something else.

Re: Elixir 1.9

#146

Post by 59nadir »

dnautics wrote: post #144
59nadir wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

dialyzer is terrible and doesn't actually work in practice, as is evidenced by the many dialyzer errors that slip through to current releases on hex of libraries even the size of Phoenix, StreamData, etc.... Even the major community members don't use it. It's not a substitute for a type system and especially not one that allows you to properly model things in it.

have you used it with elixir_ls? I find that in practice it catches about 80% of my errors before I send them to test.

Yeah, I managed to get our team members to use ElixirLS for this very reason, but in the end I found that it doesn't work when it matters. The good thing about ElixirLS is that at least you have to configure something to disable dialyzer, so by default to at least get some coverage…

In the end you need to some kind of compiler that does proper, rigorous and unapologetic type checking. If Alpaca could reach critical mass I could convince our project leader to use it, which would solve the problem entirely.

Sure, the ecosystem would likely remain the same in that the majority of people simply don't actually have any familiarity with strong, static typing, but at the very least you can now set up these guards yourself and you can have code that is much more likely to be safe and good.

Re: Elixir 1.9

#147

Post by sosborn »

giancarlostoro wrote: post #93
RexM wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What issues are you having getting Postgres setup in Windows? I've used the Windows installer[1] and have had no issues. [1]: https://www.postgresql.org/download/windows/

I was unable to figure out how to setup accounts, and I am not used to PostgreSQL, I couldnt figure out my root password, which I swear was just "developer" but that didn't seem to work. I'm used to other database engines, despite my love of the idea of using PGSQL.

That’s not a windows issue, it’s an unfamiliar software issue. Take a weekend to learn how Postgres handles accounts. It takes a little getting used to but it is very much worth it.

Re: Elixir 1.9

#148

Post by unvs »

SeanAppleby wrote: post #75
fabian2k wrote: post #47

One part of releasing Elixir applications I never found a definite answer was how closely the build environment has to match the final environment where the release is deployed. The Erlang runtime is bundled with a release, and this part is platform-dependent as far as I understand. If I'm writing an application that I'll only deploy myself I can of course match the environments exactly. But what about if I wanted to…

This sounds like a job for Docker to me. Build a container, deploy an image to Kubernetes. Someone else wants to use it, they can get it running wherever they want to run containers without worrying about the runtime environment other than just the container configuration.

We build it in Docker, but copy the release tarball out of the container and upload it directly to our servers.

Re: Elixir 1.9

#149

Post by di4na »

sansnomme wrote: post #132
nickjj wrote: post #39

If anyone is on the fence on learning Elixir / Phoenix (Elixir's most popular web framework library) please do yourself a favor and give it a shot. If you're on a time crunch and want the best bang for your buck on "why bother learning yet another language to write web apps in?" then watch this talk called "The Soul of Erlang and Elixir": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JvBT4XBdoUE I'm not affiliated with the languag…

The Authn/Authz story of Phoenix is a joke though compared to Rails/Devise or Django. The framework authors refuse to ship a first party implementation and instead leave it to the community. Problem is, the ones available are mostly extremely low level (ueberauth, guardian etc.) and you have to spend ages customizing it. On Rails it's literally two commands to set up user registration, email confirmation, password re…

I would like to point out that it is not only the company but the person behind Devise (ie José Valim). It may means, possibly, that they are not really a fan of what was created with Devise and think the experiment should not be replicated. You know.

Re: Elixir 1.9

#150

Post by di4na »

hinkley wrote: post #124
nickjj wrote: post #39

If anyone is on the fence on learning Elixir / Phoenix (Elixir's most popular web framework library) please do yourself a favor and give it a shot. If you're on a time crunch and want the best bang for your buck on "why bother learning yet another language to write web apps in?" then watch this talk called "The Soul of Erlang and Elixir": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JvBT4XBdoUE I'm not affiliated with the languag…

I sometimes joke that microservices are half of Erlang, badly implemented (I guess Greenspun’s Curse is broken?). Elixir has been second or third on my todo list for a long time. With the scary news from Vue, it might have just jumped the queue.

Thanks Robert Virding

http://rvirding.blogspot.com/2008/01/virdings-first-rule-of-...

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