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Toyotas and Chevys Are Holding Up Better Than Most Luxury Brands

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Re: Toyotas and Chevys Are Holding Up Better Than Most Luxury Brands

#141

Post by magduf »

albeec13 wrote: post #140
magduf wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I got a 2015 Mazda 3 Grand Touring so I could get the heated seats, among other things (like xenon headlights, which are an important safety feature; halogen headlights should be banned, and the IIHS agrees with me). But of course it also comes with a clunky and nearly useless nav system that costs a fortune if you look at the line-item cost. They only recently, finally, started supporting Android Auto.

Yep, I've been mulling some DIY work on replacing the headlights and adding foglamps... Despite appearing bright on my garage door, the actual street visibility of the standard headlights is pretty awful on this car. I'm not sure about 2015 Mazda 3, but I know 2016 and later cars can be upgraded to support Android Auto for a fee at the dealer (I want to say ~$500, which may or may not be worth it).

The AA upgrade is available to all Mz3 vehicles starting with the 2014 model year, since that's when they came out with the MazdaConnect system. The Mz6 is similar.

As for foglamps, I have the factory foglamps on mine and they're completely useless; I can't see them at all. Maybe it's because my xenons are so bright, but regardless, I never use them.

It should be possible for you to swap in the factory xenons if you want, though you might have to set something with ForScan to allow it to work. Not really sure about that.

Re: Toyotas and Chevys Are Holding Up Better Than Most Luxury Brands

#142

Post by potta_coffee »

rms25 wrote: post #139
shadowbannedtoo wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yea, older Toyotas are really dependable. Late 80's, and early 90's are dead simple. Make sure it's a manual tranny. I'm in the process of buying a newer car/truck for a family member, and it's depressing. So many sensors, and computers that dealership mechanics barely comprehend. I understand it's for emissions, but so many of those sensors are for comfort systems, and selling gizmos. The problem being is when they…

lol simple vehicle? maybe a lada niva (not sold in the US I think?) nothing fancy but easy to fix

I wish vehicles like that were available in the US. I'm afraid the market for them might be tiny. Americans often view their cars as an extension of themselves and their lifestyle rather than a utility.

Re: Toyotas and Chevys Are Holding Up Better Than Most Luxury Brands

#143

Post by laurencerowe »

jacquesm wrote: post #110
zokula wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By that logic Toyota should of been Chinese 20 years ago?

Toyota has always been very frugal while delivering quality, Volvo was not, so no. And I think you meant 'have' instead of 'of'. See also: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Toyota_Way , pay extra attention to section #2. Volvo took a much more 'premium' route towards quality, starting with galvanized steel bodies and other such costly measures, as well as producing on less efficient lines than Toyota. Even so, their…

Volvo's reputation for reliability tanked during the Ford years.

Re: Toyotas and Chevys Are Holding Up Better Than Most Luxury Brands

#144

Post by PaulHoule »

petschge wrote: post #19
bdcravens wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ditto for Infiniti (Nissan), Acura (Honda), and Audi (VW). I realize none of those brands are useful for making unrelated demographic-based comments, however.

For the Volkswagen group, I would list Bentley, Lamborghini or Bugatti as their luxury offerings. Audi is more middle class and sold in large numbers, at least in Europe.

It took me a long time (really seeing an awesome Audi with a V-10 motor) to perceive Audi as a luxury brand. For me it was mostly notable for self-driving accidents back in the 1980s. Yet another outpost of European Mediocrity like Renault, Fiat, Trabant, Lucus, etc.

Over time I learned more about the inline 5 cylinder engines that are common in Audis and many special characteristics but before I overcome my ignorance I had a wrong idea of the brand.

And that is the difficulty of branding luxury cars. Few of us experience a wide variety of luxury cars, so our brand image consists of some old news stories, word of mouth, seeing them on the road, etc.

Re: Toyotas and Chevys Are Holding Up Better Than Most Luxury Brands

#145

Post by PaulHoule »

bdcravens wrote: post #3
PaulHoule wrote: post #2

A Cadillac is not just an expensive car, it is an expensive car to own. (Gas, repair bills, etc.) If you are a W-2 worker you have to be at work at a certain time and you need a car that can start every morning so you can get to work on time. Higher class people can afford multiple cars, take time off from work, take a cab, etc. The Cadillac brand is appealing to many lower class Americans so you often see them in "b…

Puzzled why you would mention this brand, as it's never mentioned in the article.

I mentioned Cadillac because it's a textbook case of a brand that has gone through a long life cycle.

My grandfather, a retired bricklayer who immigrated from Poland, would drive nothing but a Cadillac in the 1980s and he was by no means rich. Many people his age drove them, particularly if they were from populations attacked by Germans in WWII such as Italian, Jewish, etc. A similar prejudice existed towards Japanese cars in the U.S. and in parts of Asia violated by Japan.

That was good for Cadillac for a while, but it became associated with old people and objectionable people (like my uncouth neighbors or my relatives who get the beat down from time to time in bars or parking garages)

GM has busted their ass and has had some success at keeping Cadillac successful despite that.

Thus Cadillac is a good base for a "theory of luxury car marketing," and calling a "BMW" a "Cadillac" is a bit like calling a "Pepsi" a "Coke".

Re: Toyotas and Chevys Are Holding Up Better Than Most Luxury Brands

#146

Post by jhayward »

kenhwang wrote: post #115
Sohcahtoa82 wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You almost touched on something car manufacturers aren't doing, and that's providing software updates. My Subaru's infotainment system has strange intermittent bugs with the Bluetooth system. I get annoyed that even if the developer fixes it, I'll never see an update without buying a new car. It's one of the reasons I'm such a Tesla fanboy. They do software updates. What's really great too is that they're done over t…

My Porsche and my mom's Acura can both do OTA updates, though they both require user acknowledgement to install. Honestly, nothing coming OTA should be urgent enough that it can't wait until the yearly service.

> My Porsche and my mom's Acura can both do OTA updates

Are those updates for vehicle control software, or the entertainment/nav system? I would be surprised if you could, for example, change the engine control software or the ABS software, or the anti-collision safety system via OTA updates.

Updating the entertainment/nav console is more common. My 2018 Ford does that too.

Re: Toyotas and Chevys Are Holding Up Better Than Most Luxury Brands

#147

Post by jhayward »

babyslothzoo wrote: post #53
randcraw wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But their truck frames are also legendary for rusting out -- a very expensive repair.

Are they anymore so than other cars driven where they salt the roads? I have not heard that.

Yes. There was a decade or so of production truck frames for Tacoma and Tundra trucks where Toyota paid to replace the frames due to rust. It was supposedly a supplier problem.

Re: Toyotas and Chevys Are Holding Up Better Than Most Luxury Brands

#148

Post by njarboe »

rjplatte wrote: post #67
amyjess wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also, Americans and Germans have different definitions of "reliable". Americans define "reliable" as "runs forever on zero maintenance". Germans define "reliable" as "runs forever as long as you stick to strict maintenance schedules".

I like the antifragile definition more. Go ahead and try to kill a 2008 Crown Vic. :)

Your car gets better the more you abuse it? Could be true if you replace broken parts with better ones.
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