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Ultima Online spent years developing a system that was destroyed by players

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141–150 of 195 posts

Re: Ultima Online spent years developing a system that was destroyed by players

#141
post #11

I played it only for a few days because they had high level players going around killing newbies for fun. My first step out of town some guy kills me in one shot. I went back to continue and he does it a second time and third time. Eventually gave up in frustration.

lol owned

don't forget to stand over the corpse and spam your bow hotkey to keep the animation on that one particular frame where it looks hunched over the corpse...

Re: Ultima Online spent years developing a system that was destroyed by players

#142

I never played UO and I've never spent a great deal of time playing any MMO. I know it would take a lot of effort but I think a neat solution would be that if all the animals were killed then people would start starving to death. I wonder if social pressures could somehow be codified into a game. If someone goes around killing all the players then maybe none of the vendors will want to do business with that person or…

This and many other experiments were tried in the MUDs and early days of MMOs. The idea of denying services to those who killed a lot worked pretty well on many UO player-run shards.

Re: Ultima Online spent years developing a system that was destroyed by players

#143

Sounds like they just left it to pure ecology to somehow balance? Did they think of making depopulated species harder to kill, or make them mate faster?

We actually wanted the scarcity, so it would affect prices and desirability. We just didn't expect everything to be scarce.

Re: Ultima Online spent years developing a system that was destroyed by players

#144
post #48

The two things I loved most about UO: * no opt-in required PVP with full looting * the bugs / exploits I had a very high bounty. :D The chance that you could actually lose months worth of work always made the game heart pounding exciting when you were running for your life. Favorite bugs: * mage/carpenter could build tables, stack them, teleport to the top, and jump through people’s roofs to loot houses * stealing we…

When I was maybe 13 or 14 I scammed someone out of a house deed using a bug related to having an item selected on your cursor while the trade window was open.

It was a really shitty thing to do, and I felt terrible and ended up giving him it back a few hours later.

Re: Ultima Online spent years developing a system that was destroyed by players

#145
post #48

The two things I loved most about UO: * no opt-in required PVP with full looting * the bugs / exploits I had a very high bounty. :D The chance that you could actually lose months worth of work always made the game heart pounding exciting when you were running for your life. Favorite bugs: * mage/carpenter could build tables, stack them, teleport to the top, and jump through people’s roofs to loot houses * stealing we…

Apropos of nothing, I've always found the behavior of the players of MMOs and online games one of the clearest telltales that sociopathy is a lot more prevalent that most people think it is.

I certainly indulged in a lot of the behaviors that you'd probably describe as sociopathic in UO. What hormonal teenager would pass up the chance to create anarchy with no real world consequences?

It doesn't mean you grow up to be a bad person, though.

Re: Ultima Online spent years developing a system that was destroyed by players

#146
post #65
post #42

MMOs as virtual worlds are really hard. Red Dead Redemption online has all the great graphics, but play is mostly people randomly killing other people. No plot. This is a big problem with MMOs - big working worlds can be built, but mostly people just kill each other. Look at the success of Fortnite - 8 million peak concurrent players. Second Life has a functional economy, but no NPC ecosystem. The economy is driven b…

> This is a big problem with MMOs - big working worlds can be built, but mostly people just kill each other. This isn't a problem with these games. It's intentional. Everyone knows how to mitigate it, you introduce a factor of significant loss aversion into attacking or being attacked, e.g. what EVE Online has where you might lose significant resources as a result. Players by an large don't like that, and just want t…

I haven't had that much trouble in GTAV. It definitely happens, but it's normally hackers rather than people abiding by the rules.

I think the fact that people have such a grind to get anywhere, and there is so much to do other than grief. Perhaps people sympathize because they are trying to do the same thing. Even though you get rewarded for it, most people don't try and ruin your missions.

It's possible I get matchmade into more polite servers because I never cause trouble. I don't know if they keep track of that. They definitely track it during each individual session.

Re: Ultima Online spent years developing a system that was destroyed by players

#147
post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is a big problem with MMOs - big working worlds can be built, but mostly people just kill each other. This isn't a problem with these games. It's intentional. Everyone knows how to mitigate it, you introduce a factor of significant loss aversion into attacking or being attacked, e.g. what EVE Online has where you might lose significant resources as a result. Players by an large don't like that, and just want t…

Something that a was part of for a long time which I thought had a good mix of this was Civcraft a Minecraft sever/collection of mods. It made pretty much all resources scarcer and plants and animals harder to grow (biomdepenedent). Then mods allowed users to reinforce blocks meaning it would take repeated breaks for them to actually disappear. (cooked stone meant 25, iron 255 I think and diamond 1255 or similar). Re…

My solution was to play modpacks that no sane person would be bothered grinding in order to grief. Svens and Test Pack Please Ignore are what our servers were based on. If you wanted to grief you would uabe to grind for hours before being capable enough to bother anyone.

So in your case and mine it seems the solution was giving serious players tools to defend themselves that were resource or time intensive to defeat, so the griefer wouldn't be bothered.

Re: Ultima Online spent years developing a system that was destroyed by players

#148
post #48

The two things I loved most about UO: * no opt-in required PVP with full looting * the bugs / exploits I had a very high bounty. :D The chance that you could actually lose months worth of work always made the game heart pounding exciting when you were running for your life. Favorite bugs: * mage/carpenter could build tables, stack them, teleport to the top, and jump through people’s roofs to loot houses * stealing we…

Apropos of nothing, I've always found the behavior of the players of MMOs and online games one of the clearest telltales that sociopathy is a lot more prevalent that most people think it is.

This is a good time to drop a mention of the psychological analysis of the four types of MUD gamers[1]

[1] http://mud.co.uk/richard/hcds.htm

Re: Ultima Online spent years developing a system that was destroyed by players

#149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I remember the vorpal bunnies. I seem to remember a bug where they would sometimes appear as an energy vortex sprite... Can you elaborate on why the creature learning was bad UX? Did people get irritated when the wolves were killing their rabbits?

It was bad UX because people couldn't easily tell the difference between a vorpal bunny and a weak one. The name wasn't enough. UO had a "consider" style skill but no one used it (I forget the name, "evaluate" or something). Eventually, "consider" was streamlined in MMOs into color coding mobiles, a la WoW. But in UO, people relied on the creature's sprite to assess difficulty. The energy vortex sprite was a differen…

Yeah! The purple llama.

The skill was probably Animal Lore.

Best MMO ever! Thanks for giving insight into it.

Re: Ultima Online spent years developing a system that was destroyed by players

#150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure why relegating destructive tendencies to virtual worlds is a bad thing. There is plenty of evidence to suggest that humans have innate proclivity to violence. The percentage of men who die violently (as in, at the hands of other humans) is around 25%. This is compared to ~2% in the 20th century, and even less today. Many mammals' forms of play function as preparation for violence (either capturing play,…

"The percentage of men who die violently (as in, at the hands of other humans) is around 25%." Did you mean to qualify this? You meant at some particular point in time?

Oh yeah, that figure was the rate in pre agricultural societies.
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