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My life with 12 programmers, 2 rooms and one 21st-century dream (2016)

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Re: My life with 12 programmers, 2 rooms and one 21st-century dream (2016)

#141

Post by ghaff »

sockgrant wrote: post #137
hfdgiutdryg wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you mean enthusiastic, curious, focused, or interested. Not passionate.

Can you explain why you don’t think a SWE can be passionate about coding? I don’t think I understand your point.

Not the parent but "passionate" can come across as code for things like all-consuming interest that I will do morning, noon, night, and weekends. It's just one of those BS words used in phrases like "We only want team members with a passion for their work" that turns a lot of people off and makes them suspect that what they really want are team members who will put in 80-hour weeks.

Re: My life with 12 programmers, 2 rooms and one 21st-century dream (2016)

#142

Post by xivzgrev »

If you are paying 1200 per month to be in soma with 12 other people that is batshit crazy. And someone is making batshit crazy money off you.

There are plenty of places you could get with a few friends for less even in soma. After the first week I would've been talking with others in there about moving out together. Seriously you work at mother f'ing Pinterest and you are ok living like this?

Re: My life with 12 programmers, 2 rooms and one 21st-century dream (2016)

#143

Post by troupe »

AndyNemmity wrote: post #83
themoat wrote: post #2

I know the author wised up and moved on, but I would rather work construction for the rest of my life than be a programmer and live like this. I worked for a startup for a couple of years that really got it right. The CTO really wanted a certain lead developer as his first hire (they had previously worked together) and the lead dev said (paraphrased, of course) "Nope. Not interested in working more than 40 hours per…

I got my break working for a startup that went big, but without any equity. The CEO asked me to work on his next startup, and I did so. I worked every hour, of every day for over a year to try and make things successful. It was never enough, and I felt like a failure regularly. It destroyed my personal life, and I still feel like there are ramifications from it. Finally they questioned the hours I was billing, from t…

> Finally they questioned the hours I was billing

So you were getting an hourly rate--not salary?

Re: My life with 12 programmers, 2 rooms and one 21st-century dream (2016)

#144

Post by walshemj »

hfdgiutdryg wrote: post #129
walshemj wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You must have worked at the wrong sort of company then - they do exist

I think you mean enthusiastic, curious, focused, or interested. Not passionate.

Well one of the DBA's I worked with at BT made his own sensory deprivation tank and used to meditate on problems.

They where also renowned for saving a huge sum of money for the company when a quarterly CSS run barfed badly - CSS was the BT billing system and the worlds largest IBM system at the time.

Re: My life with 12 programmers, 2 rooms and one 21st-century dream (2016)

#146

Post by madrox »

Based on the description I’m 99% sure I live in the apartment complex described in the article. I can confirm there are a few illegal Airbnbs operating here. The complex has even been trying to combat it by putting out a program where that’s ok as long as you follow certain rules. The rent here is nuts, but if 14 people are living in a 2 bedroom apartment here then the operator has a very profitable scam going.

I mean, the real problem is that it's impossible to break into SF if you don't already know a lot or make a lot. As long as a 1br costs $2,000 or more you'll find operations like this.

Re: My life with 12 programmers, 2 rooms and one 21st-century dream (2016)

#147

Post by canhascodez »

nikanj wrote: post #62
jen729w wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

...and now you're a 30-year-old rich guy with no mates who knew nothing of his 20s. No thanks.

There's mountains of broke 30-year olds with no mates who did nothing in their 20s. We try to maintain a false dichotomy where the alternative to working extremely hard is partying, travelling the world, and of course tons of sex. Most people don't do either.

Even when partying, travel, and sex figure highly in one's alternative lifestyle, you're not necessarily getting anything meaningful done with your life, and probably putting yourself at a competitive disadvantage economically. And you're still either working to maintain that lifestyle, or it is your job, and less fun because of that.

It's not necessarily a false dichotomy, but there ain't no such thing as a free lunch: there are opportunity costs to both paths. If you're dedicated, you can work out a way to fill your hours with travel and hedonism: and then one day you wake up and you're 40, you have no close friends or career prospects, and a worn-out liver.

Re: My life with 12 programmers, 2 rooms and one 21st-century dream (2016)

#148

Post by eaenki »

enraged_camel wrote: post #77
dan-robertson wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This does not add up. At 100k pa in San Francisco you would get something like 67k after tax, minus 30k for rent, minus (let’s be generous) 15k for other expenses leaves 22k, not “north of 50k”

Yeah, it is always deeply ironic when someone complains about people who can’t manage their finances well, then asserts that it is possible to save north of $50k with a salary of $100k in SF.

I considered that amount to be net income. Obviously.

Re: My life with 12 programmers, 2 rooms and one 21st-century dream (2016)

#149

Post by eaenki »

dan-robertson wrote: post #72
eaenki wrote: post #69

I think this article represents a small segment of people that can’t manage their finances and/or strive for better living conditions . Even at with the base rate of $100k/year - which is cheap, you can rent a beautiful $5k/m apartment and split it with a friend. Heck, you can even cook and eat organic only. Use Uber to move around. Even then, at “maximum living conditions” you should be able to save north of $50k/y.…

This does not add up. At 100k pa in San Francisco you would get something like 67k after tax, minus 30k for rent, minus (let’s be generous) 15k for other expenses leaves 22k, not “north of 50k”

I considered that amount to be net income. Obviously.

Re: My life with 12 programmers, 2 rooms and one 21st-century dream (2016)

#150

Post by ajmurmann »

zahrc wrote: post #52
ajmurmann wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>He states himself that programming was just "means to an end" for him. So why even bother? Because you gotta pay the bills somehow. This is something you only ever hear from people in our profession and I think it sometimes leads to self-exploitation. Nobody would ever say "He states himself that driving the garbage truck was just "means to an end" for him. So why even bother?"

But, hopefully, and rarely nobody has to live in that conditions to drive a garbage truck. There is so many stuff out there he he could've paid the bills with, why did it had to be programming in this kind of experience?

Programming had much better pay and benefits than most jobs. There is plenty of people who work multiple jobs and still are in awful living conditions. You should check out the book "nickel and dimed" by Barbara Ehrenreich

Also keep in mind that the author of the article is going to a boot camp. He is not getting paid, but paying. Once he is done he will likely earn ~$100k and can move into better conditions. It's very unfortunate that the author never was able to talk to the people he lived with who already had a job and find out why they still live there. Maybe they were just saving a ton of money. I knew someone who was earning a good tech salary, but chose to commute every day from Dublin for hours. That guy chose to safe the money and bought a gold coin every month.

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