This is the way to do it. Let the individual states experiment and decide.
If net neutrality really IS good/bad, you'll notice it when you cross state borders and go online.
Now that the FCC has repealed net neutrality, let’s adopt it in California
141–150 of 200 posts
Re: Now that the FCC has repealed net neutrality, let’s adopt it in California
#142Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I do however find the doom and gloom prognostications around Title II repeal to be incredibly hyperbolic and unhelpful. Fact is, Title II was only introduced in 2015. It's not like repeal in 2017 is going to end the Internet overnight. So when you say "it was only introduced in 2015", what you really mean is "it was a heavily disputed situation for 20 years in with multiple court cases being won and lost by ISPs".…
Again, hyperbolic. Some action against Comcast throttling/blocking BitTorrent (in 2007-2009) ultimately resulted in action by the FCC in 2010, made rather toothless in 2014 with the provisions against blocking and throttling struck down. So between 2010-2014 and 2015-2017 we have ~6 years of regulation, with the ISPs fighting it all the way (surprise surprise). Just to clarify: I'm in agreement that we need net neutr…
> Just to clarify: I'm in agreement that we need net neutrality. I've just been around the block enough times to know that the FCC's latest action just isn't the end of the world.
That's contradictory. Either we don't need net neutrality, and we're all being silly caring, or we do need net neutrality, and the ruckus is justified.
I don't see how we could need net neutrality, have it just be repealed, but be told that it's no big deal and we should just go about our business and not care.
I agree it's not the end of the world, in the sense that now ISPs will start to behave badly again, and either Congress or the FCC will be forced to act/backpedal (of course, after a lot of harm has already been done), or, at worst, we'll have to wait for a sane administration to be in office to restore some regulation. But that doesn't mean it's not a big deal right now.
Re: Now that the FCC has repealed net neutrality, let’s adopt it in California
#143I'm all in favour of treating Internet access as the "fourth utility". It's clear it's become almost as essential to modern life as electricity. I do however find the doom and gloom prognostications around Title II repeal to be incredibly hyperbolic and unhelpful. Fact is, Title II was only introduced in 2015. It's not like repeal in 2017 is going to end the Internet overnight. There are three problems here: 1. The U…
So far today I've learned that a two year old policy being repealed is anti-gay, will stop women from getting abortions, will stop the black lives matter movement from speaking freely, and will prevent the #metoo movement from growing. Yes, all because the internet before 2015 was completely censored and prevented free speech. If anything, I've seen a significant rise in censorship since NN was passed. The hyperbole…
You do realize that we had net neutrality regulation before 2015, right? It was just enforced via other means, means which were found by the courts to be overreach by the FCC in 2015, at which point the regulation was restored by reclassifying ISPs under Title II of the Communications Act.
Re: Now that the FCC has repealed net neutrality, let’s adopt it in California
#144Earlier quoted context omitted.
Neither one of those is a true solution. For one, we currently do not live in a climate where competition is happening. Every NN supporter would love for that to happen, but for now it's not. Second, not every place can support competing ISPs. Do the people who live in the inner city or out in rural areas not deserve a neutral net?
Local loop unbundling as in the UK does.
We tried that in the US. The incumbents did weaselly things to make life difficult for the CLECs, and eventually lobbied Congress to remove the requirement.
Re: Now that the FCC has repealed net neutrality, let’s adopt it in California
#145This is the way to do it. Let the individual states experiment and decide. If net neutrality really IS good/bad, you'll notice it when you cross state borders and go online.
Thank you. While last mile device monopolies we certainly relevant, the root issue here is that this really isn't a federal government problem.
Which is probably why the courts have been rejecting the FCC's attempts at enforcing net neutrality for the past 12 years.
Re: Now that the FCC has repealed net neutrality, let’s adopt it in California
#146Earlier quoted context omitted.
> We've already got cellular data service that's much better than the first DSL line my family got. That stranglehold is weaker than you might think. Good luck using 500GB of cellular in a month.
Ten years from now, I will.
So what do we do for the next 10 years?
Re: Now that the FCC has repealed net neutrality, let’s adopt it in California
#147Earlier quoted context omitted.
If cellular data services were not capped (or throttled down, past an imaginary line the phone company rarely shares), then you might have an argument. As it stands, 4g phone service is only a replacement for cable or dsl services for the rarest of individuals. Windows software updates alone will blow you through your cap.
You're looking backwards through time. Look forwards through time. There are all sorts of ways the last mile problem can be solved more cheaply than wiring up every household, with high network speeds.
I see all these "can be" and "could be" type statements, but the reality of the situation is that we have not solved these problems yet, but today we have no net neutrality regulation. So it's ok to think of the bright future 5 years (optimistically) down the line while we've immediately taken a huge step back?
Re: Now that the FCC has repealed net neutrality, let’s adopt it in California
#148[deleted]
Re: Now that the FCC has repealed net neutrality, let’s adopt it in California
#149I'm all in favour of treating Internet access as the "fourth utility". It's clear it's become almost as essential to modern life as electricity. I do however find the doom and gloom prognostications around Title II repeal to be incredibly hyperbolic and unhelpful. Fact is, Title II was only introduced in 2015. It's not like repeal in 2017 is going to end the Internet overnight. There are three problems here: 1. The U…
Title II was only introduced as a result of the Open Internet Order (from 2010) being overturned. Net neutrality principles have been sanctioned by the FCC since 2005; removing title II designation and moving away from these principles is a shift that should not be understated.
> Net neutrality principles have been sanctioned by the FCC since 2005
And before that no ISP would even consider tiered pricing because there were no services worth tiering. Alexadra Petri has a really good analogy over at the WaPo:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/compost/wp/2017/12/14/n...
Re: Now that the FCC has repealed net neutrality, let’s adopt it in California
#150I was under the impression that the majority voice in this argument (i.e. mortal American citizens) was completely against this. Yet it still ended up that they dismantled net neutrality. If it's true that the majority wanted to keep net neutrality, then how come the majority was ignored? Maybe I'm missing something but this seems like a good example that our voice in the US doesn't matter beyond local things like wh…
The FCC is effectively controlled by 3 Republican appointees[1] who aren't accountable to anyone by Trump. They do not care about the will of the people. Pai is a former telecom exec and his only concern is lining the pockets of his cronies with more cash.
[1] Yes, I know Pai was appointed by Obama, on Mitch McConnell's advice. That's how these things work: 5 members, split between the two parties, with the incumbent administration's party getting the extra seat.