Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Burn the Programmer

antipope.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

141–150 of 254 posts

Re: Burn the Programmer

#141

Post by Asooka »

b0rsuk wrote: post #30

Another analogy that I can't shake off is True Name and search engines. Since the dawn of time folk tales placed emphasis on true name of people and objects. Knowing the true name grants one power over something or someone. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/True_name Knowing the true name of someone lets you put it in a search engine and find out about him/her. There are some sleazy smartphone apps which let you do even…

"True Name" is what I'm reminded of most when I try to invoke tech support. Recently my ISP upgraded me to fiber and gave me a ... router. I would put some adjectives there, but I want to keep this post civil. Needless to say, I want to do some more advanced things with this device like enable restricted UPnP, maybe run some DNS-level ad blockers, port forward, etc. After some arguing with tech support I couldn't get them to divulge the password and other administration details, so I gave up and set up my own router right after it to do at least some of the things I want.

Recently however, I saw an offhand comment in a thread about this ISP, where the person mentioned the words "please bridge port 1 on my router". Well that sounds like exactly the thing I would want, but didn't think to ask for and the tech support person didn't think to offer me. Sure enough, as soon as I spoke the magic words to tech support, the router became a bridge and my own device is acting as the gateway.

The big difference between tech support and programming is that programming usually comes with a manual, while with tech support, you have to learn the True Names of the actions you want performed from some wise master who heard them from some other wise master, who... and so on.

Re: Burn the Programmer

#142

Post by foxhop »

b0rsuk wrote: post #30

Another analogy that I can't shake off is True Name and search engines. Since the dawn of time folk tales placed emphasis on true name of people and objects. Knowing the true name grants one power over something or someone. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/True_name Knowing the true name of someone lets you put it in a search engine and find out about him/her. There are some sleazy smartphone apps which let you do even…

In the anime Death Note, `True Name` is needed to perform the "ritual".

Re: Burn the Programmer

#143

Post by draw_down »

To me, many forms of artistry like singing and dance are so much more magical than anything we do. We just type a bunch of shit into computers until they do stuff, poorly.

Re: Burn the Programmer

#144

Post by morgante »

This metaphor is really stretched thin and doesn't help much with explaining anti-tech sentiments.

I really don't see why complicated wizardry is required for something to be magical. That seems to be an assumption coming from the author's genre. There are plenty of brands of magic which include extensive creation of magical artifacts which anyone can use (akin to consumer electronics).

As for anti-tech sentiments, I don't think any complicated allegory to burning witches is required. It really just feels like the natural result of technologists gaining wealth—almost every high-earning profession has significant critics (cf. lawyers, investment bankers).

Re: Burn the Programmer

#145

Post by cstross »

throwanem wrote: post #7

Getting hit pretty hard. To very briefly summarize, the article reviews an occasional trope in writing about our field, namely that it has some interesting correspondences with old-style conceptions of magic - from hermitical study of certain esoterica granting access to powers and principalities beyond the ordinary ken, through potentially hostile reaction to same among those lacking such secret knowledge and fright…

My server (where this guest article is hosted) is fielding some 20 HTTP GET requests/second and is holding up fine (load avg. is still under 1.0). I'm guessing there may be some routing problems — antipope.org is hosted in the UK.

Re: Burn the Programmer

#146

Post by randomstudent »

throwanem wrote: post #100
btown wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah, K&M. Lots of potential, many fun moments, but it's far from rationalist fiction. Still, if you ever need wish fulfillment that the time you spend at work beating down technical debt could instead allow you to fight monsters and cast spells leveraging the mana pool of a giant robot, it's a fun read/watch. From an unofficial (and somewhat grammatically atrocious) English translation of the original novel [0]: > Nor…

> it's far from rationalist fiction Is that bad? Like any didactic subtype of the genre, rationalist fiction often struggles to succeed in both of the goals set for it; the only example I've as yet found enjoyable - and extremely so! I strongly recommend it - is Unsong by Scott Alexander, also of Slate Star Codex.

Unsong is not exactly rational fiction. The author itself claims it isn't (some people claim it is despite this fact, though).

Re: Burn the Programmer

#147

Post by coldtea »

btown wrote: post #70
Raphmedia wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> As a side note, if anyone's interested in looking a bit more into "programming as magic" there's a great book series called The Wizardry If you like that kind of thing and you enjoy/don't mind anime, there's also the serie Knight’s & Magic. It is about a programmer being reborn in a world where people wield big "golem" armors. The protagonist then proceed to make his own version, completly disregarding the philosop…

Ah, K&M. Lots of potential, many fun moments, but it's far from rationalist fiction. Still, if you ever need wish fulfillment that the time you spend at work beating down technical debt could instead allow you to fight monsters and cast spells leveraging the mana pool of a giant robot, it's a fun read/watch. From an unofficial (and somewhat grammatically atrocious) English translation of the original novel [0]: > Nor…

>Ah, K&M. Lots of potential, many fun moments, but it's far from rationalist fiction.

Hasn't that gone out of style with Zola?

Re: Burn the Programmer

#148

Post by barce »

'But I can't help but feel, looking at a lot of the media pushback at the moment, that a lot of it is straight-up fantasy novel 101 "Reactions To Wizardry".'

If the last US recession is any indication, the elite (in this case, the quants), can ruin a national economy and not get burned.

I wish the author gave less vague examples to his claims.

Re: Burn the Programmer

#149

Post by civilian »

shostack wrote: post #84
NikolaeVarius wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The books Daemon/Freedom by Daniel Suarez was pretty entertaining on that front. The idea that people could literally affect the world around them via "magic spells" which mapped aliases of a invented language that would be picked up by microphones and then executed on computers. There is a section that muses about the future of humanity and how in the near future, these would literally seem like magic to anyone who…

With always listening assistants, we're practically there with Google and Alexa. We just need cooler things to interact with than communication and divination (checking the weather) "spells." As soon as we get some sort of grey goo with an API like in Big Hero 6 or wrist mounted fireball/lightning generators we're in business.

"hocus pocus fe fi fo fum, play Taylor Swift's latest album"

Re: Burn the Programmer

#150

Post by b0rsuk »

splouk wrote: post #122
b0rsuk wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even better, sometimes I wonder if history is not going in circles. Maybe so much fuss is made about True Names because it's echoes of a long dead civilization which already had computers and search engines ? Atlantis ? Quetzalcoatl ? Meroe ? Hyperborea ? Mu ? Lyonesse ? Dogons ?

Would we not find archaeological evidence of these technologies? Plastic tends to stick around for a long time.

I was only half-serious about it. My hobbies include SF and fantasy. It's an intriguing idea for a setting.
Post reply on HN