I have no side code projects to show you • Hacker News Board

Re: I have no side code projects to show you

#141

Post by tomjen3 » Wed, Oct 25, 2017, 9:01 PM UTC

ringaroundthetx wrote: post #55

kelnos wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The next time I'm interviewing in front of a hiring manager who asks me about my side coding projects, I'm going to ask them about their side managing projects.

yeah and they are going to write in the slack channel how you were so aggressive and extrapolate how bad of an employee you would be for the company, challenging every little thing with abrasive non sequiturs cute, but you'll adapt.

Unlikely.

My life drastically improved when I limited who i gave a fuck about. People who don't hire me don't make the list.

I highly recommend not giving a shit to anybody else.

Re: I have no side code projects to show you

#142

Post by Joe-Z » Wed, Oct 25, 2017, 9:02 PM UTC

jasonswett wrote: post #21

It's a very well-known fact that interviewers will often want to see some code. Because of this, I at one point spent maybe about 15 hours putting together a small project specifically to use as a code sample. This code sample, which again took maybe about 15 hours to put together, served its purpose for years. To avoid this tiny amount of easy work that has such a high potential upside is, to be frank, just dumb and…

I'm planning to look for a new position in about 6 months and that's what I was thinking to do also. Build a sample application, maybe something useful I wish I had anyway (a very simplistic budgeting app with no external data access/storage was what I was planning on). Maybe even ask my employer if I could take some code of my last projects and re-work it into a semi-independet component.

I think this is a good piece of advice here, no need to call other people dumb and lazy.

Re: I have no side code projects to show you

#143

Post by pjmlp » Wed, Oct 25, 2017, 9:03 PM UTC

notzorbo3 wrote: post #82

shortsightedsid wrote: post #25

It's funny that the tech industry is so insistent on side projects. I mean - would you hire a marketing person based on their 'side projects' or a corporate lawyer purely based on their pro-bono work? Likewise, who on earth asks a building contractor if they have any side projects? You would ask for references or find a contractor via someone you know. What about recruiters themselves? How does one judge if a person…

You know what's universally hard? Finding people who are good at their jobs. References don't matter, experience doesn't matter, education doesn't matter. Why not? Because it doesn't say anything about actual skill. What does? Side projects, where you can actually see if a person has skills. > a corporate lawyer purely based on their pro-bono work? You hire a corporate lawyer based on their public reputation. For a p…

Some of us have NDAs as part of our job.

Not everyone is happily doing FOSS projects.

Re: I have no side code projects to show you

#144

Post by mb_72 » Wed, Oct 25, 2017, 9:04 PM UTC

sumeno wrote: post #120

jasonswett wrote: post #21

It's a very well-known fact that interviewers will often want to see some code. Because of this, I at one point spent maybe about 15 hours putting together a small project specifically to use as a code sample. This code sample, which again took maybe about 15 hours to put together, served its purpose for years. To avoid this tiny amount of easy work that has such a high potential upside is, to be frank, just dumb and…

Counterpoint: In 10 years I have never had an employer ask to see a code sample so that 15 hours was better spent by doing pretty much anything else.

Nevertheless, 15 hours seems like good insurance for the time spent.

Re: I have no side code projects to show you

#145

Post by spiderfarmer » Wed, Oct 25, 2017, 9:05 PM UTC

I wouldn’t hire a sales guy that sells comparable products in his own time. Why would that be different for programmers?

You should only do sideprojects if it’s your passion or if you think it will help your career. If you’re passionate about other things: do that instead. There’s more to life than work.

Re: I have no side code projects to show you

#146

Post by yjftsjthsd-h » Wed, Oct 25, 2017, 9:05 PM UTC

2trill2spill wrote: post #122

kelnos wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe that's not a job I want, if the hiring manager is lazy enough to 'require' side projects to consider a candidate.

> Maybe that's not a job I want, if the hiring manager is lazy enough to 'require' side projects to consider a candidate. I understand that you might not want a job there and that part of a job interview is deciding if the company is a fit for you. But I wouldn't call a hiring manager lazy because they want to see examples of your work, in fact that's their job. How is a hiring manager suppose to make a thorough eval…

And how an I supposed to tell whether they're worth working for without seeing their work?

Re: I have no side code projects to show you

#147

Post by notzorbo3 » Wed, Oct 25, 2017, 9:05 PM UTC

sotojuan wrote: post #135

notzorbo3 wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not? Can you elaborate? Because 10 minutes with a Github account is enough for me to decide whether I'd hire someone or not.

Why? A lot of people (if not most) treat their non-work GitHub as a place to host random experiments and projects. Unless one plans to publish projects for others to use, no one should be forced to have perfect code for a one off idea if they don't want to. There are a lot of great engineers with empty or "bad" Github profiles.

When I look at a developer's Github profile I know that:

1. They care enough to have a Github profile

2. I can see their actual interests.

3. I know they're interested in random experiments

4. I can see if and how they treat their projects. Are they dedicated maintainers, or do they just fire off one-shot projects without ever deciding to maintain them?

And a whole lot more. A person who maintains a single shell script project with diligence is worth more to me than a thousand developers with bullshit lisp and haskell repositories.

Yes, there's a bunch of great engineers with empty or bad github profiles out there. But those engineers aren't showing me that they're great engineers. The ones with a single or few well-maintained projects do.

Re: I have no side code projects to show you

#148

Post by justin_vanw » Wed, Oct 25, 2017, 9:08 PM UTC

It's not that you must do side projects or else there is no possible way you are a great software developer. It's that lots of people are just as good as you are and also do side projects. Given the choice, why would you choose someone who is equally skilled but is less interested in the field?

When you are hiring people, you really have insufficient information to know how good they are. You can't see any larger projects they have done or get a feel for how they solve problems that aren't toy scenarios by a whiteboard. Having side projects too look at dramatically reduces the uncertainty in your estimation of their skill level.

So there you go, all else being equal of course you want someone who is 'more into' their field, and all else being equal side projects dramatically improve your confidence in their skill level. So to a competent hiring manager the author of this looks like he has less passion than his competition, and even his skill level is very poorly understood in comparison.

Re: I have no side code projects to show you

#149

Post by spiderfarmer » Wed, Oct 25, 2017, 9:09 PM UTC

Haijal wrote: post #2

I really enjoyed this post. I feel the same way, I do love coding and working on software projects doesn't feel like work to me. I spent my high school years and college years(and I graduated years after I should have from taking two years off after freshmen year) working fast food and grocery stores. I know what work feels like. However, I don't and won't spend every waking hour I have doing one thing. This life has…

It’s a bit crazy that the tech industry has grown to demand employees that live for their job and not much else. Maybe it has to do with the high income (when compared to loads of other jobs) and the fact that the world changes so fast that companies rely on employees that keep on educating themselves.

Re: I have no side code projects to show you

#150

Post by eropple » Wed, Oct 25, 2017, 9:09 PM UTC

GoToRO wrote: post #126

eropple wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think maybe there's a miscommunication here. Of course I've had conversations about my projects. Of course I've discussed them at length and in public spaces. Prospective employers have never asked. And, yes, it's clearly highlighted on my resume and my LinkedIn profile, with an entire section of my resume calling out interesting and high-quality projects. Employers do not care. Other people? Sure. Employers? No.

There are also employers that downplay your achievements just to have a reason to offer you less money. The decision to hire you was already made and they advanced to salary negotiation but without telling you. You just have to know your real market value, how good are you compared to others.

Well, yeah. That's why, now, I run my own little consultancy. ;)