Louisiana prosecutors are using fake subpoenas to pressure witnesses to talk • Hacker News Board

Re: Louisiana prosecutors are using fake subpoenas to pressure witnesses to talk

#141

Post by tripzilch » Wed, May 03, 2017, 10:17 AM UTC

Pyxl101 wrote: post #7

tcj_phx wrote: post #3

Prosecutors have a tough job. Prosecuting people who've hurt other people is the easy part of their job. Prosecuting people who haven't hurt anyone but themselves (self-medication w/ the street pharmacy), or who've become dependent on alcohol just to feel 'normal' [1]... Maybe prosecutors have to have a cruel streak to stick with the job after the novelty wears off. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14085230 S…

> The police couldn't do anything but take this woman downtown. Her daughter protested, "THIS IS NOT WHY WE CALLED YOU", but the officers were like, "whatevers". If all you've got is a hammer, everything is a nail. Sounds like her daughter might have had incorrect expectations for what it entails to call the police, though, unfortunately. The purpose and function of calling the police is generally to bring lawful for…

To be a bit more fair, these are the expectations about US police, not in general. And even if you argue this is right (I disagree), at least make sure the expectations are intuitive. Many people call 911 in the "wrong" situations, unaware that they've done something stupid, when they called 911 to ask for help.

And by that I mean if "don't call police on someone unless you're willing to send them to jail" is the accepted and defendable function of police in the US, you should be able to have a nationwide public information campaign with that exact line on it. Because it seems not everyone got the memo.

Re: Louisiana prosecutors are using fake subpoenas to pressure witnesses to talk

#142

Post by tripzilch » Wed, May 03, 2017, 10:31 AM UTC

cmdrfred wrote: post #80

zimzam wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is generally sub-optimal. Domestic violence is rarely a one-time event, rather it is a pattern of the relationship (and often the violence is reciprocal, so arresting just one of the two doesn't make sense). Some form of social service intervention for the whole family would be far better than arresting one person. After all, somebody abusing someone else likely doesn't handle stress and anger appropriately: nob…

>After all, somebody abusing someone else likely doesn't handle stress and anger appropriately: nobody's life gets easier and more manageable after being arrested. So longer prison sentences for domestic abusers then? Put them away long enough so the other party is forced to start their own life and no longer be in a situation where they are dependent on the abuser and thus unable to leave.

prison in the US is punitive, not rehabilitative.

Re: Louisiana prosecutors are using fake subpoenas to pressure witnesses to talk

#143

Post by gonzo41 » Wed, May 03, 2017, 11:00 AM UTC

Zak wrote: post #90

gonzo41 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thats not the issue, Lawyers and the like are extremely resistant to digitization. If you said we'll have a live database of all active subpoenas that anyone could read the types of fights you'd have with the legal profession would astound you. Everything runs on written signed letters and the post. Interesting fact, Barristers used to get paid by the inch of paper in their brief, so when you read old law and its ver…

Everything runs on written signed letters and the post. If you have relevant insight, why is that? Digitization makes most information-oriented work easier and it stands to reason this would be true for law as well.

Because they make a ton of cash right now using old systems.

Why change?

Sure they email but anything that may be brought o bear needs ink on it. They don't see things through a prism of 'making the system better' I had a mate in NSW (Australia) who got a DUI, He had too show up to court for it, so he decided to turn up himself because he didn't have the cash for a solicitor and he planned to throw himself at the mercy of the court. It didn't work out so well, he got absolutely spanked for not having legal representation. And i think that was wrong, Sure throw the book at him for being and idiot and driving while pissed but 'showing the court disrespect' by representing himself is crazy.

When you consider that laws of the people are for the people. it drives me mad to see decisions go to a higher authority to be considered and decided. Laws are vague but they don't have to be. our legislators really fall down when they don't explicitly define in parliment a use case of the law side by side with it inception.

Re: Louisiana prosecutors are using fake subpoenas to pressure witnesses to talk

#144

Post by wonderwonder » Thu, May 04, 2017, 4:10 AM UTC

tracker1 wrote: post #139

wonderwonder wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only people let go on a technicality are those that can afford a good attorney. People with a public defender will almost always plead out because their overworked and under paid attorney advises them too. The public defenders have hundreds of clients a year and are often only able to provide each client with a day or so of attention. If you are poor and accused of a crime odds are you are going to be found guilt…

That's why I think public defenders and prosecutors should be from a common pool, and that if their conviction/release rates are too lopsided, they are let go.

I really like this idea.

Re: Louisiana prosecutors are using fake subpoenas to pressure witnesses to talk

#145

Post by joelx » Thu, May 04, 2017, 7:22 PM UTC

wccrawford wrote: post #77

pc86 wrote: post #65

> The notice came from District Attorney Leon Cannizzaro’s office. His prosecutors are using these fake subpoenas to pressure witnesses to talk to them — a tactic that defense lawyers and legal experts said is unethical, if not illegal. The fact that the DA's office, which does not issue subpoenas , can mail to witnesses a document which says "SUBPOENA" is bold lettering and threatens arrest, is not on its face obvio…

Beyond the fact that it should be illegal, it's stupid . It's going to teach people that they might not have to comply with subpoenas because of all the fake ones. At the very least, people will be more inclined to wait until they have a lawyer before speaking with the police, which is the opposite of what they want. But it's also likely to cause people to ignore real subpoenas, which will not only hurt them but also…

I agree. I had a civil lawsuit where the opposing attorney gave a fake subpoena to one of my former employees to get him to testify. Nothing could be done about it.