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Twitter Suspends Prominent Alt-Right Accounts

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Re: Twitter Suspends Prominent Alt-Right Accounts

#141

Post by hnsucks2 »

commenting wrote: post #123
hnsucks2 wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are the banned "alt-right" commentators commensurate with ISIS propagandists? If so, how much else ought to be banned? Black power groups? Anti-fascist groups? Many "social justice" accounts post anti-white, anti-male messages with impunity. Should we then paint all people concerned with social justice with the same brush?

We already know the atrocity of a region being ruled by ISIS - imagine a country run by alt-right types. We don't have to look very far back in history to see what that would be like. Twitter is acting appropriately here in not wanting to aid the rise of such a movement.

We don't have to look far back in history to see what it would be like to live under "communists", either.

Re: Twitter Suspends Prominent Alt-Right Accounts

#142

Post by commenting »

drawkbox wrote: post #31

Not a good idea at all, I am never for censorship and I think we are losing sight of why freedom of speech is important which is insane to me. It is good all these ideas are out there even if you don't agree with them. Shrouding them will only encourage it. Strict absolutist and authoritative law/parenting almost always leads to acting out, while passive law/parenting let's knowledge decide individual choice. Putting…

There are plenty of other websites that host neo-Nazi hate speech though, it's not like the "alt-right" have no outlet for their ideas.

Twitter is under no obligation to partake in this too.

Re: Twitter Suspends Prominent Alt-Right Accounts

#143

Post by throwaway4job »

leereeves wrote: post #125
commenting wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Black Lives Matter means Black Lives Matter as well . The All Lives Matter movement, as a reaction to BLM, is essentially saying that they don't, and that the racial struggles of American Blacks are irrelevant. That is the reason why All Lives Matter is considered abusive.

Before there was an All Lives Matter movement, there was one candidate who said: "Black lives matter. White lives matter. All lives matter." Whatever may have happened after, there was little justification to destroy that candidate for saying this.

There was, and only somebody who has no exposure to black troubles; or who simply doesn't care about them could understand the problem.

Also, please don't pretend that one thing destroyed him... that's nonsense that you're peddling. But it's unsurprising that somebody peddling racist lies is a liar.

Re: Twitter Suspends Prominent Alt-Right Accounts

#144

Post by badlucklottery »

micaksica wrote: post #106
badlucklottery wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like you're talking about the paradox of tolerance: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance Twitter has to choose between upholding the ideal of tolerance (4Chan is a good example of this) and trying to create a community of tolerance by running off the intolerant crowd. I don't think there's a happy medium in this case because the alt-right seem to really like disrupting conversations that are inco…

Thank you for the link. I didn't know there was a formal name for this. > the alt-right seem to really like disrupting conversations that are inconvenient to them That's aggressive behavior, then. I'm defending the alt-right's ability to use Twitter for expression and talk with themselves, and with people that have shown interest in their ideas. If they're off brigading every source they disagree with all the time wi…

>I'm defending the alt-right's ability to use Twitter for expression and talk with themselves, and with people that have shown interest in their ideas

I don't think this was an outright purge of the alt-right, just those they saw as ringleaders of abusive brigading. Alex Jones and other big names from that group are still out there doing their thing.

>Twitter should be wielding the banhammer in an egalitarian fashion on all groups behaving this way (per the views they hold themselves to.)

Absolutely.

Re: Twitter Suspends Prominent Alt-Right Accounts

#145

Post by nnain »

alistproducer2 wrote: post #113
leereeves wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like the left seriously damaged their ability to fight racist ideas when they abandoned the idea of equality. Now, the left calls colorblindness and "all lives matter" racist. (Remember when Martin O'Malley was destroyed for saying that?) They create advantageous standards based on race, and even exclusive positions for non-white applicants. (For example, at the BBC.) And I too doubt they would object to "dedi…

HN is a bad place to discuss this sort of stuff because you're always risking karma, but here goes. As a liberal, I will say that liberals drastically overplayed their hand the last 8 years. Many of us have been saying for a while that the language, tenor, and actions of recent liberal movements was ultimately counter productive. I understand and share the demand to be treated decently and equally, but admittedly thi…

> With "demographics" on our side

You're over-estimating the appeal of the liberal movement on younger people. If some college kids can't openly talk about their inclination to right wing politics that doesn't make them 'liberals'.

Re: Twitter Suspends Prominent Alt-Right Accounts

#146

Post by hnsucks2 »

stevebmark wrote: post #139
hnsucks2 wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are the banned "alt-right" commentators commensurate with ISIS propagandists? If so, how much else ought to be banned? Black power groups? Anti-fascist groups? Many "social justice" accounts post anti-white, anti-male messages with impunity. Should we then paint all people concerned with social justice with the same brush?

This is a boring question. Reality is more complicated than drawing stark lines around everything. There may be some gray areas Twitter also has to deal with, but that's not a counter argument to the obviously positive move of removing abusive bigots.

"Boring question", yet you responded to it. Reality is "complicated", yet the move is "obviously positive". Others think it would be "obviously positive" for social justice accounts to be suspended. Many self-described social justice activists engage in racist and sexist rhetoric. Will you be just as enthusiastic to throw the label "bigot" on them? Will you be just as quick to lump them all in together?

Re: Twitter Suspends Prominent Alt-Right Accounts

#147

Post by BurningFrog »

commenting wrote: post #73
leereeves wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like the left seriously damaged their ability to fight racist ideas when they abandoned the idea of equality. Now, the left calls colorblindness and "all lives matter" racist. (Remember when Martin O'Malley was destroyed for saying that?) They create advantageous standards based on race, and even exclusive positions for non-white applicants. (For example, at the BBC.) And I too doubt they would object to "dedi…

Black Lives Matter means Black Lives Matter as well . The All Lives Matter movement, as a reaction to BLM, is essentially saying that they don't, and that the racial struggles of American Blacks are irrelevant. That is the reason why All Lives Matter is considered abusive.

> Black Lives Matter means Black Lives Matter as well.

Agreed.

And that implies that Black Lives currently do not matter, which hopefully we can all agree is a big overstatement.

I understand that movements need simple powerful slogans to chant and make bumper stickers from. That's fine. But let's not treat these three words as some definitive analysis of race in America.

Re: Twitter Suspends Prominent Alt-Right Accounts

#148

Post by hnsucks2 »

commenting wrote: post #112
stale2002 wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The people that the left calls neo nazis would likely reject that label. Just because you call a group you don't like a Nazi, doesn't make it true.

Doesn't make it false either. There is significant overlap between established neo-Nazi movements and the "alt-right", both in membership and rhetoric.

Where else are they going to go? There is a "significant overlap" between social justice and anti-white, anti-male, anti-cis propaganda. There's no convenient label to stick on that one just yet, but if you want to be consistent you're going to have to paint all social justice people with that brush.

Re: Twitter Suspends Prominent Alt-Right Accounts

#149

Post by wallace_f »

RickS wrote: post #54
grzm wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's been plenty of discussion over the past month or so on why this might happen. IIRC, check some of the Peter Thiel-related submissions from around the time he donated to the Trump campaign. Sometimes it's a function of user flags (which affect the ranking even if [flagged] isn't visible) which is a more democratic process, and sometimes it's a function of what whether the mods determine that the discussion is…

My understanding is that there are also algos at work, for example posts that are very young but have many comments fall faster, as a way to negate flame wars.

Didn't realize this. The information is not readily available here. It should be more transparent at least.

Re: Twitter Suspends Prominent Alt-Right Accounts

#150

Post by alistproducer2 »

prewett wrote: post #138
alistproducer2 wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

HN is a bad place to discuss this sort of stuff because you're always risking karma, but here goes. As a liberal, I will say that liberals drastically overplayed their hand the last 8 years. Many of us have been saying for a while that the language, tenor, and actions of recent liberal movements was ultimately counter productive. I understand and share the demand to be treated decently and equally, but admittedly thi…

I'm not sure if you intended this meaning, but it sounds like you see (your) liberal view as the ultimately right one which will inevitably triumph in the end, its just bad tactics right now. I didn't notice this until after I got back to the US after some time in an authoritarian country, and I noticed that liberals had this similar authoritarianness of being unwilling to consider the merits of the other side, a fee…

>I noticed that liberals had this similar authoritarianness

IMO this is what distinguishes a traditional liberal from a a progressive. For me, a liberal is basically libertarian with a belief the state can be used to ensure the rights of citizens are administered evenly.

IMO, if someone's actions aren't depriving another of life or liberty, the state doesn't have much standing in regulating that activity. Progressives believe state power can/should be used to protects their rights and their feelings. But, depending on the issue, you'll find conservatives taking the same stance.

Gay people getting married deprives no one of anything. Conservatives that want they're feeling protected are no different than the "SJW" so many of them rail against.

Like all things there are some grey areas. For example, the trans bathroom thing. I legitimately see both sides on that. Abortion is another I see both sides on and believe compromise is the best way forward.

You'll find "authoritarians" on both sides of the political spectrum. In some cases (like abortion) conservatives have their heart in the right places. So do progressive/liberals (environmental issues, for example). In other cases, both sides can begin to see the state as a tool to unnecessarily curtail the liberty of their countrymen.

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