Live data from Hacker News

American Children Are Drowning in Self-Esteem

1843magazine.com

141–150 of 173 posts

Re: American Children Are Drowning in Self-Esteem

#141
post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you an American? I'm European, and maybe this is just personal experience / a personal anecdote, but whenever I've had conversations with an American I found that they tend to always be really excited and then casually ignore any further communication. It's much harder to figure out for me what an American _actually_ means vs say a Belgian or a British person. No point in being an open person if you're only touti…

Americans get excited about the most commonplace things like they were 12-year old virgins. You can also see it here when some idiotic startup comes up with an idiotic business model. I can never decide if they are serious or not. Same in sports. They all go full hysterical mode when they qualify for the next round of 8. Er... boy, you do this every week, you haven't failed reaching the final once in the last 3 years…

> after we managed to escape from the bloody hugs. I don't know who invented hugs, but I hate him.

Yet you're from France, where people kiss each other as a greeting.

Re: American Children Are Drowning in Self-Esteem

#142
post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you need this codified in the modern US media cycle, just take a look at the Corey Feldman / Today Show situation. He was terrible on appearance #1, the internet let him know (as it does, both in tempered and vicious ways) and he claimed he was being bullied, then came back and did appearance #2 which was even musically worse than the first one. Then he thanks everybody for the support, rather than pay attention t…

I think kid celebrities live in their own bubble and not representative of the larger population of children.

The man is 45 years old now. He's not a child anymore so it's reasonable to stop treating him with child gloves, or, to the point, coddling his self-esteem.

Re: American Children Are Drowning in Self-Esteem

#143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Belgium. It's not necessarily the directness that I mind, it's the fact that often people are (excuse my language) full of shit. They say A, but actually mean B. Which is a trait, for example, the British have as well, but one I seem to understand a lot better than when I'm dealing with Americans.

Americans have a reputation for saying things like "let's do lunch sometime" as a sort of vague statement of agreeableness and intention to stay in contact, whereas, let's say, Swedish people would consider that to be a straightforward intention to book a lunch date.

Swedish pleasantries 101:

Sure! Let's do lunch! Week 42? No my in-laws will be visiting that week. Week 43? Sorry, I have a dentist appointment that week. Week 44, no I can't then, but maybe week 45? Oh, we have a christmas thing that week. Week 46? I'm not sure, but I think I need to keep that week open. How about we get back in touch after the holidays? Absolutely. Rinse and repeat.

Re: American Children Are Drowning in Self-Esteem

#144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This annoyed me too. I think it's fair to expect to be able to see something without JavaScript, even if it's not formatted correctly or missing fonts or whatever. I disable JS by default for performance reasons, not just because of tracking.

Why is it fair to expect this? On what grounds is the universe obligated to provide this? I fully agree the world would be a better place if websites that primarily deliver text did do so. But I'm not convinced it is reasonable to expect it. As a demographic, javascript disablers are a small minority. Additionally, they have other options for meeting many of their needs (ad blockers, privacy extensions, etc).

> Why is it fair to expect this? On what grounds is the universe obligated to provide this?

So that there can be a nice message 'This website requires JavaScript to operate.".

Re: American Children Are Drowning in Self-Esteem

#145
post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's not their job to be the technical coach of whatever they want to learn. That's insane. Of course it is! Until their skill in a subject surpasses yours, you're the only technical coach.

"Until their skill in a subject surpasses yours" Which for all but one or two subjects, it will. Look I'm not saying parents can't ever teach their children anything. What I'm saying is that parents need to know their place and role, and they can do much more good by being emotionally supportive and in general creating an environment in which children can and want to learn, than by being yet another instructor who's…

This is absolutely correct. I learnt this fast with 1st/2nd grade homework - I do more harm than good by actively participating. Sure I know what 32-29=3 but I do not know how that is being taught in the classroom and if I start sticking my oar in it goes sideways quickly. It's far more constructive to be supportive in exactly the way you mention.

Re: American Children Are Drowning in Self-Esteem

#146
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> It's likely that greeting them with criticism of their playing as they walk off the stage won't do much to encourage them to try it again. There's a way to frame it. At the end of a band performance, the audience (even if it is just 3-4 people) is encouraged to clap, even if the performance sucked. Usually, they do clap. This is enough of a positive reinforcement. When the whole thing is over, before packing up, h…

You don't teach kids I assume. I do. I am a judo coach of kids. I think the point is : It is not really up to the parents to be so critical of their kids. They should be supportive and positive. It is really up to the coach to provide the technical feedback and it is more beneficial to assess performance at the next practice when the kids are back in a learning mode. At that point they are mentally ready to practice…

You can be supportive and positive... and honest.

Being supportive of shitty performances is dishonest and shitty.

Then again... the "parents" of today cry fits if their kid plays like crap and doesn't get some sort of participation award.

Re: American Children Are Drowning in Self-Esteem

#147
To grok self-esteem, one must grasp eudaemonia.

Self-esteem is reliance on your own power to think, judge, and act; regardless of what others may feel, say, or threaten. If some snowflakes cannot stand being judged by others, or cannot judge themselves, they do not have self-esteem.

As for post-modern "teachers" who believe that unfounded praise, unrelated to achievement, is the source of self-esteem -- they are nurturing lemmings, alienated from their true human potential.

Re: American Children Are Drowning in Self-Esteem

#148
post #49

This isn't self-esteem. It's the foundation of narcissistic personality disorder. Self-esteem is simply the belief that one can be loved and respected for who they are. Needing to "achieve" (or believe that achievements are worthwhile) in order to feel good about ones self is the opposite to self-esteem.

I mainly agree but I believe the narcissism is in the parents more than the children. It is then passed on to the children.

No one wants to just admit their kid is pretty average or below average at certain things. They believe they have failed themselves and that there is no way that their offspring could just be a regular person.

Of course it has become harder to be a regular person and have a fine life in modern, Western society. We don't have the regular person jobs anymore that a regular person who is pretty average can take up like they could generations ago.

The stakes are high and a smaller and smaller group of high achievers, or what appear to be high achievers get all the spoils. A parent has an instinct to make every effort to guide their offspring to that to the point you get average kids who honestly believe they are well above average. It has been reenforced.

Re: American Children Are Drowning in Self-Esteem

#149
post #31

The article mentions that too much effort is going into teaching arithmetic by different means. Is that really necessary? Once kids get addition, subtraction, and multiplication as useful operations, and know what division is for, that kind of covers it. (Long division by hand is such a clunky operation, and done so much better by calculators, it may not be worth teaching any more.) "I like having low self-esteem. It…

Long division was probably the first algorithm I've learned. If you don't think that learning how to manipulate abstractions by applying algorithms is a usefull thing… well why not just skip arithmetics too, calculators are good with this one.

I had a mechanical calculator of the hand-crank, moving carriage type to play with as a kid. This gives an insight into how multiplication and division really work.

There's a carriage with two rows of numbers, a full keyboard (10 keys per column), a hand crank, and a second crank which moves the carriage sideways one notch. Moving the carriage is a shift by a power of 10.

To multiply, you clear everything, then punch one number into the keyboard. The buttons lock down and stay down. When you turn the crank one turn, the number in the keyboard is added to the upper row on the carriage, and the lower row has 1 added. So to multiply 25 x 25, you punch 25 into the keyboard. Turn the crank once, and you have 25 in the upper row and 1 in the lower row. Turn the crank five times, and you have 125 in the upper row and 5 in the lower row. Then shift the carriage one notch right. Turn the crank once, and you add 250 to the upper row, and 10 to the lower row. One more crank turn, and you have 25 x 25 = 650 in the upper row, and 25 in the lower row. This makes it very clear that multiplication is repeated addition with shifting.

Division is repeated subtraction. You clear everything and enter the dividend. Turn the crank once to add the dividend to the top row on the carriage. Then clear the keyboard, clear the lower row, and shift to division mode. In division mode, turning the crank subtracts from the top row while adding 1 to the bottom row. Now enter the divisor in the keyboard. Move the carriage so that the high digit of the divisor and the high digit of the dividend line up. Turn the crank. This subtracts the shifted divisor from the dividend and adds 1 to the quotient. If the dividend goes negative, a bell rings and 9999 appears at the left end of the top row, indicating you subtracted too much and went negative. That's OK; just turn the crank one turn backwards, the leading 999.. changes to 000 and the bell rings again. You now have one digit of quotient. Shift the carriage left one row and repeat. Each shift gives one more digit of quotient. When the carriage is back to the full left position, the lower row is the quotient and the upper row is the remainder. This makes it very clear that division is repeated subtraction with shifting.

This is clearer than manual long division, with all that trial divisor and guessing stuff. It reflects the basic fact that division really is just repeated subtraction with counting.

Re: American Children Are Drowning in Self-Esteem

#150
post #22

What I've noticed common among a lot of Americans is a fear/inhibition of speaking the truth, mostly to not have a confrontation. I witnessed an example of this in a music performance of a teen rock band. In this performance, the band sucked overall. The guitarist didn't know what he was doing. But everybody (guardians, parents, teachers, friends) just keep saying, "Great performance brah, awesome shit, good going gu…

There's a time and a place for critique, and immediately after a performance is neither. Only a jerk with truly low self-esteem would think that it was appropriate to offer unsolicited criticicism of the performance skills of a teenager in a rock band to their face at the performance. If it's their music instructor, maybe. But again, that's not really the place. Next lesson would be the right time and place to get th…

In my opinion, it takes a real lily to not be able to handle or constructively internalize others' criticisms as they're lobbed at you. These are important skills. I don't always welcome criticism, but when I get it, I listen.
Post reply on HN