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25% of Cars Cause 90% of Automobile Air Pollution

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Re: 25% of Cars Cause 90% of Automobile Air Pollution

#131

Post by sliverstorm »

ams6110 wrote: post #80
maxerickson wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find carbureted vehicles the most bothersome (the exhaust stinks of fuel at city speeds), so I guess enforcing emissions standards wouldn't solve the problem (because of grandfathering/exceptions).

Yes, every time I'm behind or passed by a "classic" older car with carburetors, even one that has been restored and looks like new, I'm surprised by how clearly I can smell the exhaust. By contrast modern cars emit almost no detectable smell. Hard to belive that pre-1980s all cars had exhaust odor like that, I certainly don't remember it from my childhood.

You don't notice it when you are used to it.

Pre '75 there was nothing to control oxides of nitrogen, which smell pretty awful, and combustion was never clean enough back then to control volatiles and hydrocarbons. I think all they had were secondary air injection, which was prone to failure and subsequent removal

You may not remember the smell, but do you remember the color of the L.A. skyline?

Re: 25% of Cars Cause 90% of Automobile Air Pollution

#132

Post by jcromartie »

exabrial wrote: post #126

Duh. Spend 5 mins on the road in Missouri and you'll see 100 new cars go by with a scant trace of engine noise, and 1 1994 geo metro missing an exhaust, plastic wrap over one window, two doors of different colors, with the driver on a cell phone smoking a pack of Pall Malls, riding on 3 bald tires and a spare, with the rusted tail pipe spewing white smoke. They pull into quick trip and run inside for a bottle of oil…

The fact that 100 new cars go by without a trace is evidence that the regulations work, no?

Re: 25% of Cars Cause 90% of Automobile Air Pollution

#133

Post by gerbal »

collyw wrote: post #19

Here in Europe (well UK and Spain whee I have lived and owned a car) you need to get a check every year for older cars, and that includes an emissions test. Don't you get that in the States / Canada? (It would appear that the study was done in Canada). Saying that, go to many less developed country and the cars are far worse condition. My friend always used to claim that the environmental cost of producing a new car…

In North Carolina the worst offenders are actually exempt from emissions test. Vehicles made before 1996 and diesel vehicles don't have to pass any sort of emissions tests.

Re: 25% of Cars Cause 90% of Automobile Air Pollution

#134

Post by emp_zealoth »

HeyLaughingBoy wrote: post #117
astrodust wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The salt solution to the pollution problem is somewhat convenient in the end. Cars do rust to pieces far quicker in Ontario than elsewhere.

I'm fairly sure that salt does not differentiate between polluting and non-polluting vehicles.

The point is it takes time to eat the car away, in which time the car begings to pollute more

Re: 25% of Cars Cause 90% of Automobile Air Pollution

#135

Post by baddox »

exabrial wrote: post #126

Duh. Spend 5 mins on the road in Missouri and you'll see 100 new cars go by with a scant trace of engine noise, and 1 1994 geo metro missing an exhaust, plastic wrap over one window, two doors of different colors, with the driver on a cell phone smoking a pack of Pall Malls, riding on 3 bald tires and a spare, with the rusted tail pipe spewing white smoke. They pull into quick trip and run inside for a bottle of oil…

How long does an old car with bad emissions have to last before it's worse than the environmental impact of replacing it with a new car?

Re: 25% of Cars Cause 90% of Automobile Air Pollution

#137

Post by WalterBright »

baddox wrote: post #135
exabrial wrote: post #126

Duh. Spend 5 mins on the road in Missouri and you'll see 100 new cars go by with a scant trace of engine noise, and 1 1994 geo metro missing an exhaust, plastic wrap over one window, two doors of different colors, with the driver on a cell phone smoking a pack of Pall Malls, riding on 3 bald tires and a spare, with the rusted tail pipe spewing white smoke. They pull into quick trip and run inside for a bottle of oil…

How long does an old car with bad emissions have to last before it's worse than the environmental impact of replacing it with a new car?

There's also the energy cost and pollution of manufacturing a new car.

Re: 25% of Cars Cause 90% of Automobile Air Pollution

#138

Post by justin66 »

exabrial wrote: post #126

Duh. Spend 5 mins on the road in Missouri and you'll see 100 new cars go by with a scant trace of engine noise, and 1 1994 geo metro missing an exhaust, plastic wrap over one window, two doors of different colors, with the driver on a cell phone smoking a pack of Pall Malls, riding on 3 bald tires and a spare, with the rusted tail pipe spewing white smoke. They pull into quick trip and run inside for a bottle of oil…

In many states it's a largely solved problem, with annual or biannual inspections needed before you can renew your car registration. (along with the ability for police to site you if there's a visible or audible problem)

There are loopholes, though. There are fair number of trucks in my state that are allowed to run dirty diesel trucks with basically no exhaust protections. Their industries (construction? mining?) get some exemptions under the law, I assume. It's utterly stupid, as those trucks probably account for more particulate emissions than all the other vehicles on the road put together. But God forbid someone increase their "cost of doing business" by requiring some improvements.

Re: 25% of Cars Cause 90% of Automobile Air Pollution

#139

Post by seanflyon »

SCAQTony wrote: post #123
vonmoltke wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Additionally, it refers specifically to sulfur compounds, not to air pollution in general.

Respectfully sulphur is air pollution and causes significant harm. From Wikipedia (section of Environmental impact of shipping: Conventional Pollutants) "...Of total global air emissions, shipping accounts for 18 to 30 percent of the nitrogen oxide and 9 percent of the sulphur oxides.[15] [16] Sulfur in the air creates acid rain which damages crops and buildings. When inhaled the sulfur is known to cause respiratory…

Sulfur compounds are one kind of air pollution. No one is saying that sulfur doesn't count, they are saying that other things count too.

Re: 25% of Cars Cause 90% of Automobile Air Pollution

#140

Post by astolarz »

lloeki wrote: post #128
TheCoelacanth wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They produce as much sulfur as all the cars in the world (because cars don't produce very much sulfur). For other types of pollution, cars produce much more.

As far as whacky comparisons go, I'd always wanted to do some back of the envelope calculation comparing smokers' CO2 output to cars'. Also, always wonder how much cigarette filters (that are supposed to capture various chemicals) that get thrown on the floor could contribute to (e.g.) water pollution, if at all.

Why limit it to smokers? The simple, necessary act of breathing emits CO2.
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