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Programming without objects

falkoriemenschneider.de

131–133 of 133 posts

Re: Programming without objects

#131
post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Many if not most problems ... don't really fit the functional style, and have to be made to fit Some examples would be helpful here.

Hmm...didn't realize this was (or could be) a serious question. Anything with state comes to mind. The text field I am typing this into, for example. I type on my keyboard and the state of the text field changes, and after I hit "reply", the state of the page changes with a comment appended. Before/after. Yes, you can implement this by creating a completely new page containing the concatenation of the old page with t…

Thank you for the food for thought.

Re: Programming without objects

#132
post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hmm...didn't realize this was (or could be) a serious question. Anything with state comes to mind. The text field I am typing this into, for example. I type on my keyboard and the state of the text field changes, and after I hit "reply", the state of the page changes with a comment appended. Before/after. Yes, you can implement this by creating a completely new page containing the concatenation of the old page with t…

Thank you for the food for thought.

It's pretty rubbish food he just gave you there. This is why F# has the mutable keyword. If you are so desperate to use it, that is. Most good programmers try to avoid it.

It's funny that this guy claims fitting the problem to suit FP is a bad thing. But fitting the problem to suit OOP is seemingly a good thing. There is no difference really. All problems have to be made to fit your tooling and practices in same way. The difference is how much squashing is required and the two or three second decision it takes to select the right tool. Only performance optimisations really warrant falling back to mutation of state, other than IO of course. The default should always be immutable. Don't let some brain dead OOP-only troll deter you from seeing the light.

He is speaking is riddles, like pseudo academics love to. Seriously, he is suggesting you can't have an editable text box on a GUI, written in a language like Scala, F# or OCaml? What a moron. (This link will prove particularly embarrassing to a certain person here: http://www.scala-lang.org/api/2.10.2/index.html#scala.swing....) He is arguing an argument that doesn't even exist here, but one that only exists in his own head.

Pure FP, much like pure OOP, is utter shit and painful. The sweet spot is reached by mixing the two and using a multi-paradigm language, ala F#, Scala, OCaml, etc.

Re: Programming without objects

#133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Adaptive tooling. You mean like a FP ML then ala OCaml / F#. I said I like hybrid OO-FP languages for business productivity, rather than concentrating on meaningless software architecture astronautics like that "Blue Book" you linked. I've read it, yes starting from chapter 11, and while I took it on board I find many of its ideas and practices completely toxic now. Just like Gang of Four patterns and the inane amoun…

>academic rant about "well in 1989" (no one cares) Funny, my age seemed to be important when I was "young and inexperienced". Now "no one cares"...and I am "too old and set in my ways". Which is it? Both? Does my age matter or not? Both again? Hint: if your conclusion remains the same, but your reasons for that conclusion are this inconsistent, then your conclusions is almost certainly not supported by those reasons.…

Cheeky bugger ain't you? "Had you paid attention"? "As I gain experience"? You mean on top of the 20 I already have, and which I clearly used to better effect than yourself as I'm not still rolling around believing the DDD Blue Book is the be-all-end-all silver bullet of software development. I took it on board, and kept some of its ideas in my toolkit, but really it is a book all about over-engineering for those that don't know any better. Domain modelling gives the impression of UML diagrams and all that lark, is that you? It isn't me. My domain models are honed over time as the project evolves. You act like domain models can't be done in FP. My domain models that I write in F# are sodding impressive and they only use a quarter of the lines of code required by Obj-C, Java, C# and similar ilk.

HOM? Don't make me laugh. It's just more shit for the objective world to work around limitations of the languages. A message is just an object that can be and queued somewhere, and potentially serialized. That's not special.

- Loves dynamic languages. Check. - Loves OO. Check. - Loves DDD Blue Book. Check. - Invents "new" programming design patterns all by himself believing he is the sole inventor. Check. - Dabbled with an FP language in '89 and hasn't touched FP ever since. Check. - Created his own shitty programming language to try to improve upon OOPs limitations. Check. - Dares to talk down to anyone more experienced or that disagrees with him. Check.

Yeah, I wouldn't employ you either.

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