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Goodbye, Firefox Marketplace

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Re: Goodbye, Firefox Marketplace

#131

Post by mantrax3 »

Goodbye, Firefox Marketplace?

All right, goodbye... some marginal puzzle game.

The part these folks don't get is that their tantrum is not affecting Brendan Eich as much as it's insulting to the fans of their game (whoever they are). They're trying to sic their fans and us against Mozilla with their actions.

Prop 8 was justly overturned. It was a battle worth fighting. But we're all equal now. So do we owe these two fools our support right now? Is this "battle" they're starting worth fighting? What's the cause? To prove we don't take kind to them folk like Brendan Eich round 'ere?

Hell no. Part of equality is that I, Mozilla and our society as a whole shouldn't feel the need to care more about the games (literally and figuratively) of these two guys than we care about anyone else out there, now that we're equal.

I don't care about "your history", I don't care about your wedding photos, I don't care about any of that. To me, you're just two average folks with a crappy puzzle game. Might be gay, straight, white, black, red, brown, tall, short, I don't care. Your cheap outrage doesn't mean anything more than usual to me just because you're gay.

I'm equally indifferent.

Re: Goodbye, Firefox Marketplace

#132

Post by vsviridov »

ceejayoz wrote: post #35
vsviridov wrote: post #10

"By using Arabic numerals you are helping terrorists." As long as Mozilla products do not feature a "Not to be used by gays" warning, whatever Eich does in his time is irrelevant. He's free to spend his money in any way he likes. What prevented the authors of this article to spend $1000 to counterbalance Eich's contribution if they are so concerned?

> What prevented the authors of this article to spend $1000 to counterbalance Eich's contribution if they are so concerned? Who says they didn't?

And if they did - good for them.

Did Eich imply that he wants special treatment because he donated - probably not.

Do the authors imply that they want special treatment because of this - it looks to me that way.

Again, they are free and welcome to boycott whomever they wish.

Re: Goodbye, Firefox Marketplace

#133

Post by transitionality »

wpietri wrote: post #127
transitionality wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are actively working to disenfranchise Brendan Eich of his employment. They are doing this on the basis of his political stance. This is bigotry. They are bigots. What's worse, they're hypocritical bigots, because they're trying to pass this off as some sort of anti-bigotry stance. All social justice is like this. It breaks down under the merest of scrutinty.

I believe Eich has and will continue to have his franchise. Voting, you see, being one of the civil rights guaranteed to us. Like marriage, it turns out. Being a fancy CEO, though? That's not a civil right. Especially not if attempting to deprive gay people of their civil rights makes it hard to perform an important function of that fancy CEO job: the recruitment and retention of staff.

Not being offended isn't a civil right, either.

Re: Goodbye, Firefox Marketplace

#134

Post by m0skit0 »

urbanautomaton wrote: post #20
m0skit0 wrote: post #6

I understand your posture and I totally support gay marriage, but you're mixing politics with work, and you're taking a personal issue to a professional level. It's Brendan Eich that supported the prop 8, not Mozilla. That's a very very very VERY unprofessional stance. From now on I will be very careful in buying/getting anything from your company because of huge lack of professionalism being shown here. This said, I…

> That's a very very very VERY unprofessional stance. I do not recognise this definition of professionalism, and am happy to be called unprofessional if it is the accepted one. Mozilla is an organisation that is dependent on community goodwill and support, and if the person they choose as a figurehead is one who has taken direct action to alienate a large segment of that community, then it seems to me entirely proper…

Of course everyone can react as he/she sees fit. I did.

Re: Goodbye, Firefox Marketplace

#135

Post by npizzolato »

chrismonsanto wrote: post #44

I support your decision to boycott, although I personally disagree with it. I wish you would give Brendan the chance to repent. First of all, and most importantly, it's unlikely they are going to shitcan him as CEO. Second, he has not spoken about his motivations for donating to Prop 8. If he was doing so in pursuit of abolishing the marriage institution altogether, I consider that very different than doing it becaus…

> If he came out saying he was wrong and donated 10x the amount he donated to Prop 8 to a LGBT charity, I would consider that a win. There are ways to make this right without shitcanning him.

The authors addressed this point. From the article:

> If, months ago, he had apologized and said that he’s changed his mind, then this would be water under the bridge. He has not, and said he will not, so it’s too late in my mind. Any public change of opinion at this time would only be to ensure his new powerful position at the Mozilla foundation.

That does not seem like an unreasonable position.

Re: Goodbye, Firefox Marketplace

#136

Post by vsviridov »

Blahah wrote: post #38
vsviridov wrote: post #10

"By using Arabic numerals you are helping terrorists." As long as Mozilla products do not feature a "Not to be used by gays" warning, whatever Eich does in his time is irrelevant. He's free to spend his money in any way he likes. What prevented the authors of this article to spend $1000 to counterbalance Eich's contribution if they are so concerned?

> whatever Eich does in his time is irrelevant Of course it isn't. If he was backdooring JS crypto libraries for the NSA, or shooting orphans, or selling crack, that would be seriously inappropriate behaviour and he would lose his job for it. Many people might consider it inappropriate to be fighting against gay marriage - it's not just a political issue, it's a moral one.

Well, Mayor Rob Ford allegedly indulges in substances, but as long as he does a good job of being a mayor and running his city well - who cares?

If it prevents him from doing his job - get him sacked. If not - who cares?

Should public officials who touch themselves in private be dismissed from their positions because masturbation was considered sinful and immoral?

Where does it end with all the righteous and morally superior people?

Re: Goodbye, Firefox Marketplace

#137

Post by ceejayoz »

vsviridov wrote: post #132
ceejayoz wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What prevented the authors of this article to spend $1000 to counterbalance Eich's contribution if they are so concerned? Who says they didn't?

And if they did - good for them. Did Eich imply that he wants special treatment because he donated - probably not. Do the authors imply that they want special treatment because of this - it looks to me that way. Again, they are free and welcome to boycott whomever they wish.

> Did Eich imply that he wants special treatment because he donated - probably not.

I'd say he likely wants special treatment for his particular brand of religious views.

> Do the authors imply that they want special treatment because of this - it looks to me that way.

What special treatment are they requesting?

Re: Goodbye, Firefox Marketplace

#138

Post by [deleted] »

transitionality wrote: post #119
wpietri wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Huh. White power is a political stance. One widely reviled. So is antisemitism. So if I understand you rightly, you're basically saying that everybody is a bigot on a variety of formerly-controversial issues. I guess if you want to define the word that way, sure. In which case, I'm proud to be bigoted against racists. But I think words are more useful when they don't include 99% of the population.

Every social justice warrior is a bigot by definition. Thankfully, your kind is a very tiny percentage of the population.

[deleted]

Re: Goodbye, Firefox Marketplace

#139

Post by npizzolato »

yeukhon wrote: post #69
glesica wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's against employment equality... Is it though? Are homophobes a protected class? Would a company be forced at the point of a lawsuit to hire a goose-stepping neo-Nazi if he or she had impeccable credentials?

Is gay a protected class then? If the answer is no, then homophobes is not a protected class. If the answer is yes, then homophobes is a protected class in your definition. Will I want to work with someone who is pro-Nazism? Probably not, but will I respect his belief? Yes. But will I use that to disqualify him from being my co-worker? No. I would be lying to say I wouldn't feel threaten to know I am working with som…

> Will I want to work with someone who is pro-Nazism? Probably not, but will I respect his belief? Yes.

Why would you respect his belief? There's a difference between respecting his right to hold whatever belief he wants and respecting the belief itself. The former is true, and no government should punish someone for their beliefs. The latter is not true, and I am free to judge neo-Nazis however I wish. That judgement would include not wanting to do business with them, and I would not feel bad about it.

Re: Goodbye, Firefox Marketplace

#140

Post by transitionality »

wpietri wrote: post #93
pvnick wrote: post #63

I don't know what it is about gay marriage that draws people in to this ridiculous witch hunt. I'm neutral on the issue because I feel it's complicated like every other polarizing topic, but to a lot of folks it's solid black-and-white, good-vs-evil. But the pro-gay-marriage crowd seems to go beyond that. To them, it's so black-and-white that one's not even allowed to hold the other view. These people don't even ackn…

Neutral, eh? Good for you. What a bold stance. Are you also neutral on the topic of interracial marriage? Because the saga of gay marriage is basically replaying that story 50 years later: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loving_v._Virginia Eich isn't in hot water for his personal beliefs. Indeed, as far as I know, he's never stated them. People are holding him accountable for his action, which was trying to keep gay peo…

And I'm holding you accountable for trying to get him fired.
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