Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Elon Musk: To the People of New Jersey

teslamotors.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

131–140 of 410 posts

Re: Elon Musk: To the People of New Jersey

#131

Post by mncolinlee »

MartinCron wrote: post #116
mncolinlee wrote: post #107

Having bought a Nissan LEAF, I can say with confidence that traditional auto dealers are where electric vehicles go unsold. Numerous members of our electric auto owners group share the same exact stories. You go to the dealer specifically asking for an electric car and the salesman tries to make you change your mind to another vehicle. Considering the bonus structure at most dealerships, there is no incentive to sell…

It's amazing to think that even with all of this horrible experience at Nissan dealers, the Leaf is still selling so well. Imagine how strong it would be if they had real retail support.

Actually, the worst stories came from Ford and GM dealers. Among Nissan dealers, it was more likely they either chose not to participate, told you to come back later for the right salesperson, and/or charged 10% over MSRP and refused to offer the base model.

Re: Elon Musk: To the People of New Jersey

#132

Post by jack-r-abbit »

ssmoot wrote: post #70
skore wrote: post #10

> An even bigger conflict of interest with auto dealers is that they make most of their profit from service, but electric cars require much less service than gasoline cars. There are no oil, spark plug or fuel filter changes, no tune-ups and no smog checks needed for an electric car. Also, all Tesla Model S vehicles are capable of over-the-air updates to upgrade the software, just like your phone or computer, so no v…

Tesla's site is a bit frustrating. I get most of those same benefits driving a Nissan Leaf. So I'm not really interested in a "true cost" comparison to a gas vehicle I wouldn't be buying anyways. Turns out the Model S at $1,466 as optioned is more expensive than a Leaf. :) Not that I wouldn't kill for a 300 mile range...

I'm sure the Leaf is a fine vehicle. But I see them directed at two different audiences. That logic would also question why get a Porsche 911 when you can get a VW Beetle for a fraction of the price? They are both German engineered gas vehicles, after all.

Re: Elon Musk: To the People of New Jersey

#133

Post by gohrt »

stackcollision wrote: post #126
dbarlett wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Bridgegate" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Lee_lane_closure_scandal

I really hate how every scandal now has "-gate" appended to it.

Mitchel&Webb: Watergategate

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vB9JgxhXW5w

Re: Elon Musk: To the People of New Jersey

#134

Post by darkarmani »

Edmond wrote: post #32

I hope people don't forget the profit motive of Mr Musk. It seems technology entrepreneurs have adopted the rhetoric of "just trying to make the world a better place" while conveniently ignoring their own profit making motives. I am no friend of car dealers but I am also not going to be suckered by a self-serving sales pitch. While I don't necessarily support the NJ move, I think we should start asking questions abou…

> I think we should start asking questions about economic value flow. If people live in one place yet all their economic activity is directed to some place on the other side of the country, what is the long term effect of this on their local economy?

What do you mean? Isn't there economic value in owning a Tesla? Just because the money flows the other way doesn't mean there isn't value in owning the product.

Re: Elon Musk: To the People of New Jersey

#135

Post by skore »

larrys wrote: post #103
jusben1369 wrote: post #29

Musk is massively disingenuous and rather insulting to our intelligence. But he's a heck of a salesman and makes a wonderful car. Like many persuasive people he arrives at an answer and backs into rationale but makes it appear the other way around. I'll give you just one example. The law of the land in NJ is that you can't sell in NJ unless through a dealership. That's the current law. Those laws need to change to al…

"Musk is massively disingenuous and rather insulting to our intelligence. But he's a heck of a salesman " Agree. And makes you wonder a bit about the marketing materials surrounding these cars, huh? He's trying to make as if he's acting in the best interest of the people of the state of NJ. When it is very clear that his motivation is his own interests and selling his car. And making more money for himself. Most busi…

> When it is very clear that his motivation is his own interests and selling his car. And making more money for himself. Most businesses don't make it that obvious.

You cannot possibly be saying that with a straight face.

Pretty sure Musk has the high road rather solidly booked all to himself when it comes to his credibility concerning trying to change things for the better when you compare him to any other auto corp.

Re: Elon Musk: To the People of New Jersey

#136

Post by jusben1369 »

revelation wrote: post #52
jusben1369 wrote: post #29

Musk is massively disingenuous and rather insulting to our intelligence. But he's a heck of a salesman and makes a wonderful car. Like many persuasive people he arrives at an answer and backs into rationale but makes it appear the other way around. I'll give you just one example. The law of the land in NJ is that you can't sell in NJ unless through a dealership. That's the current law. Those laws need to change to al…

I think you missed the part where they instituted new rules effective starting in April, which is when the existing Tesla stores will be reduced to galleries. In your vigor, you seem to have misled only yourself.

See above or below.

Re: Elon Musk: To the People of New Jersey

#137

Post by Jgrubb »

mullingitover wrote: post #60
xal wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you explain the reference please?

Gov. Christie's office ordered the most heavily trafficked bridge in the country (if not the world) closed for political revenge. He is desperately trying to throw his staff under the bus to avoid accountability for this. It's a very delicate subject for him right now, and Musk bringing it up is cruel and yet at the same time (imho) totally fair play.

Completely fair play. To me, Musk is just pointing out that Christie is a corrupt bully (who would absolutely play this exact same card if the situations were reversed).

Re: Elon Musk: To the People of New Jersey

#138

Post by protomyth »

ericd wrote: post #100
protomyth wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Although personally satisfying for the writer, that is a pretty good example of something never to write in a letter that you want to positively influence a situation. Referring to a scandal by a politician when lobbying isn't really going to work, and all letters addresses "to the people" are lobbying.

I think it does a good job of reminding everyone that there's a trend of corruption in his opponent's administration, which is a pretty useful political trick.

Elon Musk is not running for governor of NJ, so viewing it as "a trend of corruption in his opponent's administration" is not advisable.

The other problem with this is that the Gov is still has popular support and Mr. Musk probably negatively influenced those people. Further, making this an actual political fight is really not something Mr. Musk should be looking towards because their is a fair amount of material the Gov can use on Mr. Musk.

Think of every attack that can be levied against the elitism of Silicon Valley and personify it in the person of Elon Musk. It could get quite nasty and the valley doesn't really do well in political games.

Re: Elon Musk: To the People of New Jersey

#139

Post by stcredzero »

strlen wrote: post #104
sheetjs wrote: post #31

> the auto dealer franchise laws were originally put in place for a just cause and are now being twisted to an unjust purpose ... and Christie can argue that allowing Tesla creates a slippery slope whereby Ford and GM and other companies end up crushing the franchisees that the law intended to protect. Musk is trying to find a middle ground that just doesn't exist unless you accept governments creating one-off laws t…

There is no slippery slope here if the law is states something like: "contracts between existing de-facto oligarchy of car manufacturers and dealers remain as is, new entrants are free to set their own terms". Everyone is talking about how we can't trust Elon Musk since he is acting in his rational self-interest. Yet why should we assume that Christie is acting out of the pure goodness of the heart? Politicians too a…

Everyone is talking about how we can't trust Elon Musk since he is acting in his rational self-interest.

Except that Elon Musk's rational self-interest appears to genuinely involve a vision of the world I really like. Given all the money and effort he's put in toward that vision and the many hours of public speaking and personally answering questions consistent with that, you'd better hope he's the real deal.

Re: Elon Musk: To the People of New Jersey

#140

Post by skore »

jliptzin wrote: post #65
easymovet wrote: post #4

Very saddened by the blatant corruption in our government. Where do I vote for a new government based on ethics and accountability (apart from New Zealand).

The HN community should band together and buy an island and create our own government there.

No, no they should not. You really don't want to be involved with those kinda guys:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seasteading

It's the sort of hyper-liberterianism that looks and sounds like a passable option until you consider it for more than a second. And then there are the proponents for this kind of insanity...

Post reply on HN