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Did The TSA and JetBlue Deny Travel For Looking Muslim During Ramadan? No

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Re: Did The TSA and JetBlue Deny Travel For Looking Muslim During Ramadan? No

#131
post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As was noted in the article, JetBlue made that determination on their own. You can chose to believe the government told him no, but you'd be ignoring the stated facts in and just making shit up.

No, according to the second article they made their decision based on his state of mind after the government singled him out and messed with him. The government is directly responsible for that chain of events.

But not the decision not to let him fly.

That he was agitated after the his ordeal is understandable, but so was JetBlue's decision not to let him board a plane.

Re: Did The TSA and JetBlue Deny Travel For Looking Muslim During Ramadan? No

#132
post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I suspect they just sent him the article prepared by DHS PR department interns along with a check.

Yes, clearly it's impossible for the actual event to have transpired differently than what the person said. No one ever exaggerates things or misrepresents them on the internet.

It's possible, likely even, but the extremely antagonistic way the article was written gives it pretty much zero credibility.

Especially with nitpicking like pointing out it was Port Authority police rather than NYPD - it was an irrelevant correction, as the point is he likely saw shields, and most people would have no clue about that kind of distinction and would simply assume NYPD, given that it is one of the best known police forces on the planet.

Re: Did The TSA and JetBlue Deny Travel For Looking Muslim During Ramadan? No

#133
post #11

This reeks of the most cowardly pandering to proto fascist mission creep I've read in a long time. I mean take these key quotes for instance: >Mr. Mukerjee appears to have been flagged by the Behaviour Detection Officer (BDO) >Mr. Mukerjee became verbally aggressive >Mr. Mukerjee becoming further agitated and aggressive after testing positive for explosives, as well as him repeatedly reaching for his not-yet-manually…

I agree, it's easy to say that someone became verbally aggressive and agitated after the fact. It doesn't excuse poor treatment, and it's probably not even true, since it's a judgement call and impossible to disprove.

Re: Did The TSA and JetBlue Deny Travel For Looking Muslim During Ramadan? No

#134
post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I popped his name into google to see what else he did. Judging from the autocomplete he appears to have pissed off some people previously.

Holy crap! There is even a blog where somebody disgruntled chronicles all his alleged misdeeds: http://fishfraud.blogspot.com/ Some articles that caught my eye: http://fishfraud.blogspot.com/p/about-fishfraud.html http://fishfraud.blogspot.com/2010/11/projectweddingcom-revi... http://fishfraud.blogspot.com/2010/11/warning-to-national-me... http://fishfraud.blogspot.com/2010/11/steven-frischling-in-c... http://fishfra…

Good work.

Great claims require great evidence. It could be a jilted lover or frmr business partner.... Who knows. Are there any public records which support this counter-blogger's claims?

The other thought is: does the original blogger have any hard evidence beyond nitpicking and counter-claims provided by JetBlue to trash our traveler?

Re: Did The TSA and JetBlue Deny Travel For Looking Muslim During Ramadan? No

#135
post #4

Sorry I am still taking his side. This writeup is not only just nit-picking his story - it's using the TSA as witness against itself. I am most certainly not going to the take TSA's word for what happened. That would be like taking the NSA's word to congress for example. What do you think happens by lesser agencies on non-sworn testimony when they see what their big-brother can get away with? And the "behavior detect…

This is one of the major problems with unregulated and unsupervised NSA activities (and other agencies). We've seen them blatantly lie about their actions, to the public and to congress. They've lied under oath without any repercussions.

I don't know if I can believe any official reports. They say the FBI wasn't involved, and I believe them but "they" have proved unreliable in the past. This is the fertile soil for conspiracy theories and it's the governments own fault.

We're left with Occam's razor. Mr. Mukerjee was probably feeling a little hot-headed that day and maybe he mouthed off to the first TSA guard who placed him on some list. He probably doesn't like or trust the TSA since he opted out of their preferred method of scanning. It's pretty believable that the agents don't know much about hinduism since they are not targeting potential hindu terrorist, but extremist muslim terrorist (if you consider terrorists true muslims which I don't). It seems likely that he set off multiple security alarms. Police TSA aren't going to know about venture capital or care about your job. They are just asking to see if you slip up or act nervous. Israeli security simply asks "how are you doing today" not b/c they care but b/c a persons reaction tells them a lot and they will drill down if you get agitated by their questions.

In the end, Mr. Mukerjee did nothing wrong. He got agitated by something that would anger all but the most patient individuals. That's actually the scary part. Al-Qaeda and other terror groups have shown again and again that they are VERY patient and persistent. One of their agents would probably have gone through the main scanner and if detected remain very affable and friendly with the TSA.

Re: Did The TSA and JetBlue Deny Travel For Looking Muslim During Ramadan? No

#136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's the same feeling I was getting from this article. It was completely disingenuous (or better put, an outright lie) to say that he was not detained. The police were keeping him against his will to determine if he was guilty of a crime. That pretty well fits the definition of detainment.

The article makes it very clear what "detained" vs. "not detained" means, in this context. Mukerjee wasn't being detained, or kept, beyond the basic protocol of "unscreened passengers have to be escorted out of the terminal." Mukerjee was free to leave, he simple had to leave the building entirely. He could not just leave and then step back into line, as was his intention, for numerous utterly sane reasons.

Either he was detained or his bag was seized, or both.

Keep in mind that if you are pulled over for speeding, you are technically detained for the duration of the traffic stop.

Re: Did The TSA and JetBlue Deny Travel For Looking Muslim During Ramadan? No

#137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It does not seem unreasonable to me to believe that someone (other than law enforcement) broke into his apartment and, finding it nearly empty, rifled through his suitcase, and took the picture simply out of anger. None of us on here know exactly what happened but the above seems (to me) just as likely as law enforcement breaking into his apartment. I would think they would also visit the apartment/residence he was v…

It's certainly far from proof, but it is very disconcerting. Let's go through the lines of evidence here. First off, there were apparently no visible signs that anyone had broken into his apartment. If the FBI or the police had picked the lock or if they had gotten the super to let them in and told him or her to remain silent about it then that would explain such an absence. A thief could also pick the lock but why w…

Is HN really turning to conspiracy theories now just to justify any "TSA bad" stories that make the frontage? Lets stick with actual evidence, which for the break in there doesn't seem to be any actual reports or proof of this happening.

Re: Did The TSA and JetBlue Deny Travel For Looking Muslim During Ramadan? No

#138
post #45
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is complete bullshit. "Limbo" is not a thing. Either you are being detained, or you are free to leave.

No, there's a third option: You will be free to leave after some defined event occurs.

In that case you are detained. Temporarily, but you are still detained.

Re: Did The TSA and JetBlue Deny Travel For Looking Muslim During Ramadan? No

#139
post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So they have their procedures. But that raises the question - what is the point? Let's assume the threat is real, someone with nefarious intent is not-detained, escorted to outside the building and left to his own devices. What is to stop him from simply turning around, re-entering the building and going through a different screening station? I'm pretty sure the answer is "security theater."

Well, if you'd read the rest of the article, you'd see the procedures are designed to ensure that, if he's going to do that, he's doing it without any implement of harm on him, or least not one the TSA can find. Also, pointing out that it's impossible to deter a truly convicted person from a heinous act does not mean all deterrents are pointless. Yes, MUCH of what the TSA does is theater, and doesn't do much to keep…

That does not mean he wasn't detained. If you aren't free to go, you are detained.

If you are pulled over for speeding, until the officer lets you go, you are detained.

So not only was he detained but his bag was seized. Now arguably everyone is briefly detained by the TSA on condition of travel, and arguably all bags are seized briefly. However, that is why there needs to be scrutiny on these practices.

Re: Did The TSA and JetBlue Deny Travel For Looking Muslim During Ramadan? No

#140
post #29

Airport security is frequently humiliating. I myself have been nearly reduced to tears just by customs agents when crossing the border on business. However, this man set off a bomb detector. He set of the machine that detects bombs, repeatedly. After that event, nothing Mr. Mukerjee reported is particularly surprising, and I would expect to have a similar experience if I set off the same detector. I don't believe his…

Regardless of what chemical detectors he set off, and what suspicions they had, it was disgraceful that he was "detained" for such a long period without being provided with food and water.

Do you really think it is appropriate that such interrogation techniques are used on travellers after they have been cleared of carrying any sort of explosive device?

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