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After 25 years in jail, the Internet blew my mind

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Re: After 25 years in jail, the Internet blew my mind

#131

Post by ed209 »

crag wrote: post #130
ed209 wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

and my point is that smoking should not be legal, carrying weapons should not be legal, pot should not be legal. Drinking is difficult because there are reported health benefits as well and most of the world does not drink to excess. You may think that doing those things in your own home, with your own body is nobody's business but yours. That, however, is naive. Let's say you overdose on cocaine or you get lung canc…

"... there are reported health benefits as well and most of the world does not drink to excess..." Ahh when was the last time you been to a football game in Europe? Or heard about a fight breaking out in the stands? Trust, they aren't smoking pot. So yes the rest of the world does abuse alcohol. Oh and by the way, cocaine and pot also have health benefits. In fact, cocaine is still used today. And I doubt anyone will…

so a legal drug like alcohol is actually causing havoc in society, as you so vehemently point out... and you are advocation MORE drugs be made legal?

Really look forward to a night out when a bunch of people are buying heroin in one bar, cocaine in a another and ecstasy at the club - sounds awesome!

I am from Europe, yes I've been to those games. No doubt alcohol is a problem. Comparing pot to alcohol is just dumb, they have complete opposite physiological effects. I've seen what long term pot smoking does to normal people, with normal jobs and normal lives - it's not harmless.

I have not seen any studies on the health benefits of pot or cocaine as part of a regular lifestyle - can you enlighten me? I've seen reports of pot and ms or cocaine used by doctors for procedures, but I never heard of them being recommended for regular consumption as a way to improve health.

And, again, point out the draw backs of some drugs (alcohol) does not mitigate the problems associated with other drugs (pot).

Re: After 25 years in jail, the Internet blew my mind

#132

Post by sstrudeau »

ed209 wrote: post #131
crag wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"... there are reported health benefits as well and most of the world does not drink to excess..." Ahh when was the last time you been to a football game in Europe? Or heard about a fight breaking out in the stands? Trust, they aren't smoking pot. So yes the rest of the world does abuse alcohol. Oh and by the way, cocaine and pot also have health benefits. In fact, cocaine is still used today. And I doubt anyone will…

so a legal drug like alcohol is actually causing havoc in society, as you so vehemently point out... and you are advocation MORE drugs be made legal? Really look forward to a night out when a bunch of people are buying heroin in one bar, cocaine in a another and ecstasy at the club - sounds awesome! I am from Europe, yes I've been to those games. No doubt alcohol is a problem. Comparing pot to alcohol is just dumb, t…

> so a legal drug like alcohol is actually causing havoc in society, as you so vehemently point out... and you are advocation MORE drugs be made legal?

Yes, because making alcohol illegal actually made things worse in the very same ways strict drug prohibition creates vast revenue streams for organized crime and incurs a great deal of violence.

Re: After 25 years in jail, the Internet blew my mind

#133

Post by ferrouswheel »

babuskov wrote: post #51
asveikau wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole time reading this article, I thought, sounds good, but having spent 25 years in jail he must have done something pretty bad. Then I read that Wikipedia article and it turns out he was caught selling cocaine in his 20s... Man, say whatever you want for drugs being bad, but that's kind of a BS reason to rob someone of their youth like that. For 25 years I thought maybe he'd killed a guy.

I completely disagree with you. Think how many lives he destroyed by hooking people to cocaine. I have a friend who became a cocaine addict by falling for a nice guy who turned out to be dealer. She's still struggling, but she'll never get last 10 years of her life back. Now, multiply that with 30+ people he was dealing to, and you get much more than 25 years. Punishment should be hard unless we want to see more and…

Taking cocaine does not imply you'll become an addict and it will control your life. Many high functioning drug users never get in trouble with drug use, but we never hear those stories.

People can become alcoholics, and some people are more susceptible to it, that doesn't make everyone an alcoholic.

A much more effective strategy is education and regulated legal supply. People require licenses to sell, and potentially to use, and tax the harms in order to provide health resources for the people that do get in trouble.

It'll be cheaper, and fewer people will die.

Re: After 25 years in jail, the Internet blew my mind

#134

Post by ferrouswheel »

goggles99 wrote: post #116
burntsushi wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Obviously the sentence was not harsh enough What? Does this mean that the death penalty isn't harsh enough because people still murder? > It is impossible to predict the murders and overdose deaths that a drug kingpin ultimately causes. A problem mentality indeed. The claim that a drug dealer "causes" overdose is just as ridiculous as the claim that a car salesman "causes" car crashes. > Crime has fallen every year…

>What? Does this mean that the death penalty isn't harsh enough because people still murder? Most murders are not pre-meditated. It people were allowed to cool down for 12 hours somehow, right before they comitted a murder, the murder rate would drop by 80%. All drug dealing is pre-meditated. You are not comparing similar things. >A problem mentality indeed. The claim that a drug dealer "causes" overdose is just as r…

Don't blame women for your insecurity and inability to function in this world.

Re: After 25 years in jail, the Internet blew my mind

#135

Post by ferrouswheel »

ed209 wrote: post #122
WA wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You make it sound like your children don't have a choice whether to take drugs or not. You could argue similarly by replacing drugs with anything (legal) that could harm your children. For example, do you blame motorcycle vendors for being responsible for deaths and hardship among the families of motorcyclists? Drugs and motorcycles are certainly different, but it's a bit too easy to blame drug traffickers or dealers…

Unlike recreational drugs, motorcycles are a useful tool that enables society to go about its business. Knives also enable me to prepare dinner and surgeons to remove my appendix. I don't think that class A drugs carry the same risk/benefit ratio, do you? Also, I think you missed the part where I said that society and family carry some of the responsibility for that child taking drugs, but then you were too busy argu…

Class A drugs actually have a range of benefits, from curing addiction(!), depression, PTSD, migraines, and inspiring people creatively. This is not for all drugs, and some also have associated risks, but they are not by nature "bad".

Unfortunately, these drugs often are unpatentable, so it's safer to make them illegal (class A so that law says they "have no medical purpose"). Then big pharma can find less effective substances, sell them for more, and it's all under the guise of safety.

Re: After 25 years in jail, the Internet blew my mind

#136

Post by ferrouswheel »

ed209 wrote: post #129
crag wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. All drugs should be legal. What I do in my own house to my own body is my business. Not to mention, most of the violence caused by the illegal drug trade wouldn't exist. My point is, in America it's legal for me to smoke cigarettes, carry weapons of mass destruction in my pocket, drink liquor (anywhere I please) but it's not legal for me to smoke a joint. That's my point.

and my point is that smoking should not be legal, carrying weapons should not be legal, pot should not be legal. Drinking is difficult because there are reported health benefits as well and most of the world does not drink to excess. You may think that doing those things in your own home, with your own body is nobody's business but yours. That, however, is naive. Let's say you overdose on cocaine or you get lung canc…

More people are injured by horse riding than MDMA. Under your regime, will you ban all risk taking including sports?

How about starting a startup? That often results in elevated stress and could impact health. Let's ban that too.

How about we take the ridiculous amounts spent on the drug war, regulate supply and tax products for potential harms, then use that to educate people on safety and provide support to people that get in trouble.

Not all drug takers have a problem with drugs. I know successful and effective CEOs, developers, prolific scientists, government policy analysts, and many others that take drugs. They are often more effective than any other people I know. So please check your stereotypes.

Re: After 25 years in jail, the Internet blew my mind

#137

Post by ghotli »

asveikau wrote: post #128
ghotli wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The first two sentences in this comment add nothing to the discussion. Is this kind of thing ok on HN these days?

I felt the comment was talking down about the crack epidemic. It's probably a function of age and location, but for some people (such as those with a history in the hardest-hit cities) it isn't that distant, as if to be something you'd look up on Wikipedia because you've never heard of it. I don't think that's all too unreasonable. Your comment, on the other hand, does nothing but say that my comment is worthless.

The community here has shifted it seems. Comments like mine that questioned the way in which we argue used to be encouraged.
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