Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Stop Generalizing About Europe

jonasbentzen.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

131–140 of 369 posts

Re: Stop Generalizing About Europe

#131

Post by john_flintstone »

crazygringo wrote: post #34

This post feels awfully pedantic. While it may not be clear to non-Americans, when Americans talk about "Europe", they're generally talking about Western Europe, not Eastern, and are excluding the UK too. They almost certainly aren't including Russia. (Just like when Americans talk about Asia, they aren't usually thinking of India.) Of course, that's geographically inaccurate -- but it's what we usually mean. The Eur…

Sorry, but no.

I've been in discussions recently with a French company whose development team is based in Dublin (Ireland for the geo-illiterate). Most of the tech staff in Dublin were East European, and the company's HR department was in Romania - a non-EU country.

This EU centric perception is a media perception, and bears no relationship to the reality on the ground in Europe.

Company in question was owned by a a UK multi-national, and builds software for banks all over the world. The 'Western EU' leaning is pure fantasy. I understand why Americans like it - it's simple and straight forward, and appeals to people from what is basically a simply and straight forward country - but it's just not the reality on the ground.

!+": Romania: !+": Wasn't even aware of its EU status. Why? Because when you think EU, it simply doesn't pop up. Which points vividly to the diversity of the EU. Romania, even now, is no one's idea of a Western country. It simply ain't. It ain't western; it ain't even that European. Tarring all of Europe with some kind of EU white wash is simply foolish.

Re: Stop Generalizing About Europe

#132

Post by davidw »

john_flintstone wrote: post #131
crazygringo wrote: post #34

This post feels awfully pedantic. While it may not be clear to non-Americans, when Americans talk about "Europe", they're generally talking about Western Europe, not Eastern, and are excluding the UK too. They almost certainly aren't including Russia. (Just like when Americans talk about Asia, they aren't usually thinking of India.) Of course, that's geographically inaccurate -- but it's what we usually mean. The Eur…

Sorry, but no. I've been in discussions recently with a French company whose development team is based in Dublin (Ireland for the geo-illiterate). Most of the tech staff in Dublin were East European, and the company's HR department was in Romania - a non-EU country. This EU centric perception is a media perception, and bears no relationship to the reality on the ground in Europe. Company in question was owned by a a…

> Romania - a non-EU country.

Romania is in the European Union. It is not in the Euro area monetary union, though.

Re: Stop Generalizing About Europe

#133

Post by vladd »

john_flintstone wrote: post #131
crazygringo wrote: post #34

This post feels awfully pedantic. While it may not be clear to non-Americans, when Americans talk about "Europe", they're generally talking about Western Europe, not Eastern, and are excluding the UK too. They almost certainly aren't including Russia. (Just like when Americans talk about Asia, they aren't usually thinking of India.) Of course, that's geographically inaccurate -- but it's what we usually mean. The Eur…

Sorry, but no. I've been in discussions recently with a French company whose development team is based in Dublin (Ireland for the geo-illiterate). Most of the tech staff in Dublin were East European, and the company's HR department was in Romania - a non-EU country. This EU centric perception is a media perception, and bears no relationship to the reality on the ground in Europe. Company in question was owned by a a…

Romania is an EU country since 2007: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Member_state_of_the_European_Un...

Re: Stop Generalizing About Europe

#134

Post by nmcfarl »

saraid216 wrote: post #109
gyardley wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your ignorance of the respective areas is showing. It's hard to talk about a common culture between California and Louisiana when neither California nor Louisiana has a common internal culture. In Louisiana, spend some time in Houma, and then some time in Shreveport. Louisiana has a Cajun-dominated region and a region that's very much part of the Old South, and they're not much alike. In California, spend some time i…

And you can make the exact same comments about any country in Europe.

And I think this is where this all leads - at some level all generalizations fail. All the way down to the individual level. Generalizing about my cube-mate fails: he hated Mexican food, till the new waitress started at our Mexican lunch spot. So now he hates all Mexican food minus that 1 restaurant.

---

This example is actually 10 years old, it but leapt to mind.

Re: Stop Generalizing About Europe

#135

Post by xradionut »

espadrine wrote: post #73
mbell wrote: post #5

I could make an almost identical argument about the usage of terms like "Americans". The states and even cities themselves are all very different.

> I could make an almost identical argument about the usage of terms like "Americans". I hear you and partly agree, but the comparison is a stretch. In USA, how many hours by car do you need to find a local that doesn't speak your language? The very same ad can easily be broadcast US-wide. Never do that in Europe (not that anyone has ever tried). Trying to impose a law on all EU countries alone is usually unsuccessfu…

"In USA, how many hours by car do you need to find a local that doesn't speak your language?"

Zero. The janitors and the landscapers of the company don't speak much English. The baker at the ethnic grocery down the street doesn't speak English, but his daughter does.

Re: Stop Generalizing About Europe

#136

Post by chris_j »

john_flintstone wrote: post #131
crazygringo wrote: post #34

This post feels awfully pedantic. While it may not be clear to non-Americans, when Americans talk about "Europe", they're generally talking about Western Europe, not Eastern, and are excluding the UK too. They almost certainly aren't including Russia. (Just like when Americans talk about Asia, they aren't usually thinking of India.) Of course, that's geographically inaccurate -- but it's what we usually mean. The Eur…

Sorry, but no. I've been in discussions recently with a French company whose development team is based in Dublin (Ireland for the geo-illiterate). Most of the tech staff in Dublin were East European, and the company's HR department was in Romania - a non-EU country. This EU centric perception is a media perception, and bears no relationship to the reality on the ground in Europe. Company in question was owned by a a…

Minor nitpick: Romania has been a member of the EU since 2007.

Re: Stop Generalizing About Europe

#137

Post by dimitar »

Stereotypes and generalizations are so common because they are useful, not because Americans are ignorant. Not just because no one cannot remember every detail about everything - generalizations are models, simplifications of reality, which help you make an informant decision confidently. For example: are you willing to adhere to workplace regulations? If its a low priority maybe you should skip Europe.

I'm from an EU country that in my opinion was 150 degrees (180-30) from what Martin Varsavsky described, but I still appreciated his article. I know it meant Western Europe and I learned that US entrepreneurs are a lot different. Generally.

Re: Stop Generalizing About Europe

#138

Post by pelle »

benatkin wrote: post #69
crazygringo wrote: post #34

This post feels awfully pedantic. While it may not be clear to non-Americans, when Americans talk about "Europe", they're generally talking about Western Europe, not Eastern, and are excluding the UK too. They almost certainly aren't including Russia. (Just like when Americans talk about Asia, they aren't usually thinking of India.) Of course, that's geographically inaccurate -- but it's what we usually mean. The Eur…

Yes. We're talking about Western Europe, which doesn't include Scandinavia, which is where the author's from. And I don't think there's a conspiracy involved, I think it's just because that's where the largest economies in the area are: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(nomin... The author has visited Western Europe but many Americans have too.

I'm from Denmark and grew up knowing that we and the rest of Scandinavia is part of Western Europe.

Re: Stop Generalizing About Europe

#139

Post by pelle »

_delirium wrote: post #60
crazygringo wrote: post #34

This post feels awfully pedantic. While it may not be clear to non-Americans, when Americans talk about "Europe", they're generally talking about Western Europe, not Eastern, and are excluding the UK too. They almost certainly aren't including Russia. (Just like when Americans talk about Asia, they aren't usually thinking of India.) Of course, that's geographically inaccurate -- but it's what we usually mean. The Eur…

> ambivalent feelings toward entrepreneurs I haven't found this to be the case in the Nordic countries, at least. You can't walk around a corner without tripping over a startup incubator, and there's a lot of interest, among both techies and the public (and the government), about where the "next Nokia", "next Spotify", "next Rovio", etc. are going to come from. Germans also lionize their famed "Mittelstand", which is…

In Scandinavia there is a small vocal subculture talking "startup". It is however a very small subculture. The majority of employees you will encounter will not be very entrepreneurial.

Re: Stop Generalizing About Europe

#140

Post by neumann_alfred »

abduhl wrote: post #45
neumann_alfred wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't say all Americans are that way, I just said some (rather loud, rather constant) Americans generalize themselves; while I don't quite get that vibe from Europe. Movies, presidential speeches, whatnot... it's really not just some nationalists, you export that a lot. That doesn't say anything about those who have no use for that stuff and see through it, I'm just claiming you have a lot of people who don't. I c…

You're making the mistake of thinking of Europeans as a whole and comparing it to America. I've met plenty of Europeans who were incredibly nationalistic from France, Great Britain, Austria, Czech, etc. and they are extremely vocal and proud of their national heritage/identity. They love telling people that they're French, English, Austrian, Czech, etc. but they never claim to be European. Similarities could be drawn…

They love telling people that they're French, English, Austrian, Czech, etc. but they never claim to be European.

Uhm, which was my point exactly?

Post reply on HN