Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Zohran and the Short Link

iamwillwang.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

131–140 of 236 posts

Re: Zohran and the Short Link

#131

Post by WarmWash »

grackasthebig wrote: post #120
mercutio2 wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“Just” is doing a lot of work in your argument. The government grocery store tender is filled with exceptionally bad ideas. When he’s a normal politician doing normal things, he seems great. When he’s sticking to his guns on naive populist things he’s part of a worrying affection for counterproductive government programs.

Yeah but under the norm none of us owe you anything including food or healthcare; that is... we don't have to care you exist Why volunteer such? Under capitalism there is no honorific obligationism. Pay me to give a shit you exist or go hungry and die What's that? You want a social and communal society? Sounds like naive populism.

>Pay me to give a shit you exist or go hungry and die

Socialism has the same problem, except it's "go to work and give a shit for less money or all of society dies"

Re: Zohran and the Short Link

#132

Post by anyonecancode »

mikaeluman wrote: post #98
voidUpdate wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, as far as I'm aware, "socialism" just means that the means of production are owned socially, instead of privately. But is there anything that he's actually done that is disagreeable, or is it just that many news outlets are saying "socialism = bad, Mamdani is socialist, therefore Mamdani = bad"?

Take the case of "city owned stores" to "combat food price inflation". Well. The city does not actually produce food. Stores get their produce from wholesalers. This is where the "city stores" will get them as well. Only now, regular stores know the city will undercut them in price using taxpayer money. So any location next to a city store will become poison. And soon all you will have (for some people) are the city…

Grocery stores aren't evenly distributed throughout the city, though, and there are neighborhoods were either there is no store at all nearby, or the store that exists has poor quality and high prices. In those locations, the dynamic of a city-owned store undercutting a "normal" store isn't really going to apply since there isn't really a "normal" store in the area.

So much, of course, depends on the execution -- a crappy city store won't be a help to anyone -- but the concept isn't inherently bad on its face.

Re: Zohran and the Short Link

#133

Post by sjacob »

mikaeluman wrote: post #98
voidUpdate wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, as far as I'm aware, "socialism" just means that the means of production are owned socially, instead of privately. But is there anything that he's actually done that is disagreeable, or is it just that many news outlets are saying "socialism = bad, Mamdani is socialist, therefore Mamdani = bad"?

Take the case of "city owned stores" to "combat food price inflation". Well. The city does not actually produce food. Stores get their produce from wholesalers. This is where the "city stores" will get them as well. Only now, regular stores know the city will undercut them in price using taxpayer money. So any location next to a city store will become poison. And soon all you will have (for some people) are the city…

If cheaper grocery prices would pull people away from more expensive stores then Wholefoods wouldn't exist. People don't simply go to the cheapest grocery store.

"Of course, with prices much cheaper than in other parts, you will likely get crowding at these stores. Leading to the infamous bread lines of the Soviet Union or Venezuela or what have you."

There are over 100+ no-questions-asked community-run pantries in NYC where you can get groceries for free, not to mention others that ask for some sort of ID. You'd think that the crowding and bread lines would form here first no?

Re: Zohran and the Short Link

#134

Post by SV_BubbleTime »

SwellJoe wrote: post #6

Given how untrustworthy the most popular social media providers have proven to be, it's madness that so many politicians and government accounts still use things like Xitter or facebook as their primary communication medium. Even ignoring the political misinformation that is rampant on these platforms and often promoted widely by the platform because it is inflammatory and gets lots of engagement, they also severely…

Given how untrustworthy politicians have proven to be, it's madness that so many people on social media and still keep falling for the same acts.

Re: Zohran and the Short Link

#135

Post by ricoxicano »

satvikpendem wrote: post #99
piker wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

His policies are socialist. Some of us still perceive that as a bad thing.

Socialism is workers seizing the means of production. No country is actually socialist at all, as in that case it means every single company is actually a coop of equal shares among the workers. Socialism does not mean when the government does something, at best that's social democracy.

[dead]

Re: Zohran and the Short Link

#136

Post by cogman10 »

mikaeluman wrote: post #98
voidUpdate wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, as far as I'm aware, "socialism" just means that the means of production are owned socially, instead of privately. But is there anything that he's actually done that is disagreeable, or is it just that many news outlets are saying "socialism = bad, Mamdani is socialist, therefore Mamdani = bad"?

Take the case of "city owned stores" to "combat food price inflation". Well. The city does not actually produce food. Stores get their produce from wholesalers. This is where the "city stores" will get them as well. Only now, regular stores know the city will undercut them in price using taxpayer money. So any location next to a city store will become poison. And soon all you will have (for some people) are the city…

> The city does not actually produce food. Stores get their produce from wholesalers.

> Leading to the infamous bread lines of the Soviet Union or Venezuela or what have you.

These two statements don't follow one another. If the city stores are getting their goods from the same distributor any other grocery store is, why would the availability of that food dry up leading to breadlines?

> Ironically, the city sets prices based on a relative level to "normal stores". So it's not as if this is some "good capitalist competition". It's not as if it's a "temporary measure until catastrophe A is over".

This happens in "normal" stores as well. There's a concept called a "loss leader" where a store deliberately sells some goods at lower than market rates specifically to attract shoppers.

> There is put simply no way this experiment ends in a way that is positive for New Yorkers.

My state, Idaho, has had state ran liquor stores for my entire life. Our socialist alcohol hasn't resulted in booze lines or bedlam. I see no reason why a grocery store in a very wealthy city couldn't work.

Re: Zohran and the Short Link

#137

Post by SV_BubbleTime »

voidUpdate wrote: post #67
WarmWash wrote: post #28

I'm not a huge fan of Zohran, but man, I will admit that it is so refreshing to have a leader that isn't senile and is actually in touch.

Genuine question, what is it you don't like about Mamdani? I don't live in NYC, so I don't have first-hand experience with him, but I've not seen many complaints about him (other than things like "he broke the dress code at the swimming pool that one time", which is "Obama's tan suit" levels of petty)

[flagged]

Re: Zohran and the Short Link

#139

Post by pyrale »

TimorousBestie wrote: post #116
zaphar wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair Mamdani has stated that he is a "socialist" numerous times. So I don't think that the characterization is wrong necessarily.

He identifies as a socialist, sure, but his implemented policies (what GGP was calling socialist) are mostly standard-issue municipal management. Is it socialism to hire temporary labor for snow removal? To fix potholes? My boring municipality in the middle of a red state does that and nobody calls it socialist.

> My boring municipality in the middle of a red state does that and nobody calls it socialist.

I will never not be amazed at the US meaning of "red state" vs. what the rest of the world means by "red state".

Re: Zohran and the Short Link

#140

Post by forestrywat »

slopinthebag wrote: post #60
anigbrowl wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You didn't even specify which link had the errors; 'the first one I managed to make work' is something known only to you. Complaining about a problem while not providing any hints on how to reproduce it is not a great way to win friends and influence people.

Okay well I don't care about "winning friends" and "influencing people" on the internet.

Or, apparently, having a conversation on a forum for conversation.
Post reply on HN