Gross. Age verification is a completely degenerate level of privacy violation
Illinois just passed a law that puts Linux on the hook for age verification
131–140 of 553 posts
Re: Illinois just passed a law that puts Linux on the hook for age verification
#132I feel like all of these laws are being designed backwards. Content providers, like MPAA films, should have to identify what sort of content they are providing. Then I can give my kids a device configured to allow some or all of that at my discretion. Requiring my kids' devices to advertise their age (or their age "bucket", as if that was a meaningful difference) to protect them is not doing me or my kids any favors.
I'm now pretty convinced that this is the best argument for persuading non-technical and non-internet-privacy minded people why this is a problem. It's hard to explain all the technical factors that make it impossible to implement without compromising privacy... but it's pretty easy to get them to understand the real intent. If you start them thinking through what mechanisms would make sense _if_ the original premise truly was protecting kids from content they aren't ready to see, it's easy to arrive at that answer, and equally easy to see why "everyone must provide their ID so we can verify their age" probably comes from other motivations.
Re: Illinois just passed a law that puts Linux on the hook for age verification
#133Here's my slight defense of something like this, in theory. I have not read the text of the bill. If OSes build a standards-based way to query age of user that is logged-in, where non-admins are not allowed to adjust the age bucket, then parents can configure devices on first use to have an OS-wide enforcement of age controls. Apps and sites would query the OS, not individual app/site accounts, for user age and act a…
Storing age is no different to storing name or address to me, it’s just a field in /etc/passwd, and root can change it.
I would disagree. First, passwd(5) is a venerable and rigidly-defined format. Can we please stop abusing poor GECOS for everything?
Second, storing PII in a world-readable file is unacceptable. Linux is multi-user so the administration needs to be responsible about sensitive data like that! Find somewhere else to stash it!
Re: Illinois just passed a law that puts Linux on the hook for age verification
#134Cool. I'd like to propose a federal law wherein every lawmaker, state or otherwise, musts either demonstrate they correctly enough understand the subject they're legislating over (for every single instance of legislative act they perform) or get approval from an actual accredited expert panel before being allowed to push any more inane bullshit that will help noone in the future.
It’s a series of tubes! It’s not a big truck!
Re: Illinois just passed a law that puts Linux on the hook for age verification
#135Thankfully for now this dragon is a hydra. Too many paths to block for now. The whole TPM fiasco with windows is preparation to put the genie back in the bottle. Soon, much sooner than I would like you will need a Global ID to access the internet, which will require an "internet safe operating system". It's only a matter of time. Get your sneakers ready folks.
Re: Illinois just passed a law that puts Linux on the hook for age verification
#136Serious question: This is a out-of-box "ask for age" requirement. No one is "verifying" anything. Why are we using this misleading headline? Face scans, ID cards, all that stuff that makes everyone nervous, are specifically not a part of this. To imply that it is verification is propaganda.
As a parent, I'd be very happy with this "age declaration" method, as I also don't think the 'verification' others push for is at all worth the risks. All parents want is to put the devices permanently into a mode that flags it to third parties as belonging to a minor, so they can't just hold up their hands and say "idk they said they're 18" like they do today.
Re: Illinois just passed a law that puts Linux on the hook for age verification
#137Earlier quoted context omitted.
I respect your principled stance on one hand, while on the other I’m amazed that someone as successful as you hasn’t learned that logic doesn’t dictate how governments work. Don’t make a target of yourself, there are countless ways for a government to make your life miserable.
I will never show fear to tech-illiterate bullies trying to compromise constitutionally protected rights. That is how freedoms get quietly lost. Users need to see that the people in positions of influence in FOSS projects they trust are not afraid of this bullshit. I -hope- someone is stupid enough to take a case like this to court so we can establish some much needed case law here. These overreaches deserve to be co…
> constitutionally protected rights
Wait, which constitutionally protected right is that? I'm an attorney and constitutional scholar and am particularly interested in what right you believe is being violated here.
Re: Illinois just passed a law that puts Linux on the hook for age verification
#138Earlier quoted context omitted.
So OEMs will only be shipping Windows and that's more or less it.
And it will be wiped immediately as usual, so sure whatever.
Or it will have some new TPM/SecureBoot guard rails to not let minors install unapproved systems. Think of children again ;)
Re: Illinois just passed a law that puts Linux on the hook for age verification
#139Not that I'm condoning it, but this law requires self-declaration, not verification. It might sound pedantic but the practical difference is huge. Self-declaration means that the system asks the user to declare if they are a minor. Nothing is verified. Age verification typically means a system which checks ID or has other enforcement measures to try to verify age.
I don't see the argument here. You can easily adjust the law to force verification. You seem to assume that "this is now final, nothing will change after that". Why would you assume this to be the case?
As someone who's pushed on a technical law change.... "easily" DEEPLY, DEEPLY misstates the challenges of getting the law changed. Fun fact: people who oppose something tend to get in the way.
Re: Illinois just passed a law that puts Linux on the hook for age verification
#140Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's a feature that states can (mostly) decide for themselves what laws they want to live under.
when it comes to commerce it isn't because it makes doing business impossible. How is this practically going to look, Canonical, Red Hat and open source maintainers are going to ship 50 different Linux distributions in the United States? The reason the US has fairly robust interstate commerce laws is because if you don't you'll have trade barriers between states. Even the most well intentioned internet company can't…
Yes the constitution specifically identifies commerce as something Congress has the power to regulate. That doesn't mean states can't have their own rules. Many states have various forms of legalized cannibis, different laws regulating firearms, or automotive emissions.