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SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

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Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#131

Post by sersi »

close04 wrote: post #123
21asdffdsa12 wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also obviously the money is running out when you rush to testing

I think you're right and hope this stunt damages their valuation. As an investor I would have serious doubts about a company which at this stage doesn't have the brain or the money to have a proper development plan and resorts to desperately throwing anything out there, hijacking an Airbnb rental as their lab. That reeks of incompetence, maliciousness, and desperation rolled into one.

I was on the fence about investing in them and ultimately passed on it. Reading the article, glad I did so.

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#133

Post by RobotToaster »

Rebuff5007 wrote: post #112
RobotToaster wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This was my thought. I can understand not wanting to go to the hassle of trying to explain that you're testing an experimental prototype robot to a confused Airbnb owner. What I find inexcusable is not owning up to the damage and paying to fix it when your prototype goes on a rampage of destruction. Moving fast and breaking things is fine, as long as you fix the stuff you break...

> Moving fast and breaking things is fine, as long as you fix the stuff you break... What? No its not. Breaking things can cause harm that is not always "fixable", particularly if its not your thing to break.

Well, that statement kinda implied what was broken has to be fixable, at least I thought it did.

And what is going to be impossible to fix or replace in a budget !hotel room?

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#134

Post by pjc50 »

blindriver wrote: post #83
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #26

The only way to stop this is for charges to be brought against the employees who made the bookings under false pretenses.

Why should this be criminal and not civil?

It's probably easier to handle as civil negligence. Criminal damage has an intent component. Of course it would hinge on discovery - as soon as you find an email to the effect of "we know this will cause damage, let's test it on someone else's house", that counts as intent.

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#135

Post by pjc50 »

kibwen wrote: post #39
chatmasta wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These bots are going to arrive suddenly and in huge volume. I’m not sure when it will happen, but when it does, it will be extremely fast. The software is basically ready, and the hardware isn’t too far off. The processing latency will be problematic but with local inference improving quickly, this will all come together into the perfect storm for the arrival of the bot army. I don’t think any of us are prepared for…

No, neither the hardware nor software is anywhere even remotely ready, where by "ready" we mean "safe to share living spaces with unsupervised children and pets without EVER accidentally reducing your toddler to a fine paste, literally a 0% chance". That's the minimum that people will accept, and that's more than ten years away, if it ever happens.

You'd be surprised. I think Waymo have already proven this; not perfectly safe, but below the care threshold. And the demand for childcare is huge. Of course, what then happens is how the ensuing child neglect case falls out.

We're probably going to end up with the situation where the burden "it is considered criminal child endangerment to leave your child alone with the robot" falls on the parents, not on the robot manufacturers.

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#136

Post by elzbardico »

tclancy wrote: post #126
elzbardico wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the banality of evil is a recurring theme in human history.

Yes, but I was kinda hoping Hannah Arendt’s lessons had been internalized and we would progress. More the fool I.

One thing that I've been noticing more and more, is that it looks like every dystopic work of art, be it 1984, brave new world or idiocracy, ends up being used as an instruction manual.

So far we were implementing only the first two ones, with AI, it looks like we decided to accelerate Idiocracy implementation too.

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#137

Post by msh »

Rebuff5007 wrote: post #112
RobotToaster wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This was my thought. I can understand not wanting to go to the hassle of trying to explain that you're testing an experimental prototype robot to a confused Airbnb owner. What I find inexcusable is not owning up to the damage and paying to fix it when your prototype goes on a rampage of destruction. Moving fast and breaking things is fine, as long as you fix the stuff you break...

> Moving fast and breaking things is fine, as long as you fix the stuff you break... What? No its not. Breaking things can cause harm that is not always "fixable", particularly if its not your thing to break.

In a rental unit you should not have things that can’t be replaced. People who rent it will break things, either by accident or purpose (there are always idiots around).

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#138

Post by ChoGGi »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #18
TZubiri wrote: post #14

Can any lawyer clear this up for me? If the company ends up having no commercial success and the lawsuits for damages rack up, can they just close the company file for bankruptcy and face no consequences? Or is there some civil or criminal risk to this behaviour?

Did an individual or the company rent the Airbnb?

From the article it sounds like an individual did.

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#139

Post by jermaustin1 »

cpeterso wrote: post #111
close04 wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The were incompetent enough to go to real world testing when these issues would have been obvious from a basic model kitchen test. Obviously their bot is in the very early development stages where it can't do any of the basic things right, they're nowhere near the phase where they needed real world testing. You don't need a real house to tell that your bot keeps damaging furniture, floors, and other items. You iron t…

The company could also test the bots in their employees’ homes for no cost. If employees aren’t comfortable with the bots in their own homes, then they shouldn’t let them loose in others’.

I personally would not want my employer putting anything with an AI or camera inside my home. That would be a non-starter. And I work for a company that uses cameras and compvis.

I don't want any of my personal life observed by my professional life and vice versa. It is bad enough that /I/ have to observe both and try not to pass judgement on myself.

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#140

Post by ChoGGi »

mvdtnz wrote: post #95

This is not Donovan's "home", as the article states. It's his house and rental business. And he was snooping on his guests when he was taking the rubbish bins out and happened to notice cables and people typing on laptops inside the house - which I'm sure is an explicit violation of Airbnb policies.

They turned off his security cameras so he went to take a look. At least that's the impression I got.

I'm a little surprised he didn't knock and ask to go in.

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