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Canada’s Bill C-22 Is a Repackaged Version of Last Year’s Surveillance Nightmare

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Re: Canada’s Bill C-22 Is a Repackaged Version of Last Year’s Surveillance Nightmare

#131

Post by jkaplowitz »

joenot443 wrote: post #128
jkaplowitz wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You do realize that that former Liberal leader Justin Trudeau is not the Liberal leader who is currently pushing this bill, right? Justin Trudeau is now a private citizen with no official role in his party, in the House of Commons, or in government beyond what applies to any former leader/MP/PM (e.g. former PMs remain Privy Council members). The current Liberal leader Mark Carney has spent his whole career in the ban…

It seems disingenuous to suggest that the choices Trudeau made in his cabinet aren’t still being felt by the LPC and the rest of the country to this day. Painting Carney as a progressive conservative doesn’t seem like a good faith position, I’m skeptical of your earnestness here.

> It seems disingenuous to suggest that the choices Trudeau made in his cabinet aren’t still being felt by the LPC and the rest of the country to this day.

I agree that would be disingenuous, but I never said that. Of course the choices made by every Canadian prime minister in their cabinet are still being felt by their party and the rest of the country slightly over a year after they leave office. Trudeau is no exception.

> Painting Carney as a progressive conservative doesn’t seem like a good faith position, I’m skeptical of your earnestness here.

It’s a very widely held position and widely discussed in many sources.

As one bit of evidence that he has some appeal to the conservative wing of the political spectrum, Carney himself stated in February 2025 that former Conservative prime minister Stephen Harper had offered him the role of finance minister in 2012. The response by Harper-era staffers tried to make him look as bad as they could without lying, which is unsurprising treatment of a then-Liberal leadership candidate given how partisan politics works nowadays, but notably they never denied that what he actually said was accurate.

Source: https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/mark-carney-stephen-harper-...

Re: Canada’s Bill C-22 Is a Repackaged Version of Last Year’s Surveillance Nightmare

#132

Post by vkou »

motohagiography wrote: post #129
vkou wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you think becoming an American colony is going to be an 'out', I have some seafront property in Edmonton to sell you.

The King is the head of state, it's trivial to switch that to a US appointee. It's the highest likelihood on the list of alternatives to accepting a surveillance state. Canadians don't have the anything for a civil war, nobody who believes in anything will take MAID, Alberta secession has to go through imported "votes" and a process designed to sabotage it. If Canada had any kind of national identity it would not hav…

If you think that Canada can be described as a Chinese puppet by serious people, I'm not sure I can take any of the rest seriously. I'd suggest that you stop listening to MAGA propaganda in the particular, and anglonews in the general.

Re: Canada’s Bill C-22 Is a Repackaged Version of Last Year’s Surveillance Nightmare

#133

Post by triceratops »

jrflowers wrote: post #85
triceratops wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What would your family do if someone with a gun came and took away their land or their business?

Hire a lawyer to get it back from the police.

That's the most confusing answer I've ever read.

Re: Canada’s Bill C-22 Is a Repackaged Version of Last Year’s Surveillance Nightmare

#134

Post by firmretention »

EmbarrassedHelp wrote: post #30

Both the mandatory data retention and encryption backdoor requirements will cause encrypted messaging services like Signal, WhatsApp, iMessage, Matrix, and others to block both Canadians and Canadian businesses from their services. If you live in Canada or are impacted by this legislation, then you need to tell both your MP and the Minister of Public Safety of Canada to reject this legislation. --- The Canadian Civil…

>then you need to tell both your MP and the Minister of Public Safety of Canada to reject this legislation

lol, for what reason? the LPC always gets its way

Re: Canada’s Bill C-22 Is a Repackaged Version of Last Year’s Surveillance Nightmare

#135

Post by Bender »

tardedmeme wrote: post #100
Bender wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I honestly don't know how things will (d)evolve from here. Official back-doors a.k.a. lawful intercept to encryption is an interesting twist, not a new proposal by any means but in the past this always ended up being hush-hush with small trusted inner circles of people at tech and telephony companies as they could never get such laws passed. If this passes I suspect it will be much harder to monitor terrorist activit…

Most countries currently have laws that openly require telecommunications providers, but not messaging apps, to do lawful intercept. This isn't hidden. Most spy agencies find having to get a warrant from a judge for each target too cumbersome, so they tap into fiber cables and do unlawful intercept as well.

Most countries currently have laws that openly require telecommunications providers, but not messaging apps, to do lawful intercept. This isn't hidden.

That is the official legal implementation but not really how it works. Large tech companies are incentivized to cooperate with governments and will do so without hesitation. Governments can make it nearly impossible to operate a business. Cooperation clears that hurdle. This is not some theory but directly from the horses mouths. I have spoken to all the executives at every company I have worked for and this is the general consensus in large companies.

Re: Canada’s Bill C-22 Is a Repackaged Version of Last Year’s Surveillance Nightmare

#136

Post by LocalH »

motohagiography wrote: post #129
vkou wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you think becoming an American colony is going to be an 'out', I have some seafront property in Edmonton to sell you.

The King is the head of state, it's trivial to switch that to a US appointee. It's the highest likelihood on the list of alternatives to accepting a surveillance state. Canadians don't have the anything for a civil war, nobody who believes in anything will take MAID, Alberta secession has to go through imported "votes" and a process designed to sabotage it. If Canada had any kind of national identity it would not hav…

The US is tripping over itself to enact a surveillance state with the assistance of big tech corporations. Becoming a US territory would not, in any way, prevent a surveillance state from taking over.

Re: Canada’s Bill C-22 Is a Repackaged Version of Last Year’s Surveillance Nightmare

#137

Post by HelloMcFly »

vanjoe wrote: post #76
HelloMcFly wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't want to get into a big debate on libertarianism, but the The "freedoms" being celebrated here are largely freedoms from accountability: the freedom to build without inspections that protect neighbors from fire hazards or ensure you're building on land you own; the freedom from alimony that ensures a financially dependent spouse who made shared life decisions isn't left destitute because those decisions reduce…

Isn't that what all freedom is? Every restriction on freedom is for the benefit of society. At least according to those making those restrictions. Even the soviets thought that the reason suppression was necessary was so that those at the top could fix the country and make it better for everyone.

> Every restriction on freedom is for the benefit of society.

A different way to say it: restrictions on freedoms are necessary to enable other freedoms. There is no such thing as total freedom when one lives in a society because one for of freedom for person A will impugn on a different freedom for person B.

Re: Canada’s Bill C-22 Is a Repackaged Version of Last Year’s Surveillance Nightmare

#138

Post by EmbarrassedHelp »

betaby wrote: post #68

Comments are locked on reddit and brigades are downvoting the articles about it. https://old.reddit.com/r/canada/comments/1rrxqje/liberal_gov...

That's a months old article, though I'm not sure why it was locked?

The r/Canada subreddit unfortunately does not allow articles that the mods deem to be "blog posts" or from organizations they don't consider to be news organizations.

Though the r/Canada community is still overwhelmingly against encryption backdoors, data retention, and mandatory age verification.

Re: Canada’s Bill C-22 Is a Repackaged Version of Last Year’s Surveillance Nightmare

#139

Post by EmbarrassedHelp »

firmretention wrote: post #134
EmbarrassedHelp wrote: post #30

Both the mandatory data retention and encryption backdoor requirements will cause encrypted messaging services like Signal, WhatsApp, iMessage, Matrix, and others to block both Canadians and Canadian businesses from their services. If you live in Canada or are impacted by this legislation, then you need to tell both your MP and the Minister of Public Safety of Canada to reject this legislation. --- The Canadian Civil…

>then you need to tell both your MP and the Minister of Public Safety of Canada to reject this legislation lol, for what reason? the LPC always gets its way

Why? Because its better to message multiple government officials, rather than betting on a single one. MPs also have a different role than government ministers do.

Re: Canada’s Bill C-22 Is a Repackaged Version of Last Year’s Surveillance Nightmare

#140

Post by EmbarrassedHelp »

AlanYx wrote: post #4
josefritzishere wrote: post #2

Why are they so determined to do evil?

It's a confluence of two things: (i) Canada's government policy community tends to be heavily influenced by legislative trends in the UK/Aus/NZ; this particular one is almost a direct import from the UK's ill-advised Online Safety Act, though worse in some ways, and (ii) a series of Canadian Supreme Court decisions, most notably 2024's Bykovets, which the security intelligence apparatus in Canada feels has totally ha…

In the video from the CBC Gary Anandasangaree specifically mentions that the Canadian Centre for Child Protection (C3P) has been lobbying him for this legislation, and that he recently met with them to reaffirm his commitment to passing it.

https://www.cbc.ca/player/play/video/9.7198040

C3P wants encryption backdoors, has been involved with lobbying for encryption in numerous other countries.

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