Earlier quoted context omitted.
I personally don't want people violently dragged out of their cars at gunpoint when they don't actually have warrants.
So?
Maybe the practice is what you would always want. Not me.
Flock cameras keep telling police a man who doesn't have a warrant has a warrant
131–140 of 152 posts
Re: Flock cameras keep telling police a man who doesn't have a warrant has a warrant
#132Earlier quoted context omitted.
This wouldn't be a story if the cops did not put the wrong license plate in the system. How is it Flock's fault? Flock is just doing what it is being asked to do! Let me put in simple terms: Flock flags license plates that are given to it. Someone, somewhere says, license plate "ABCD1234" has a warrant out. And guess what, if Flock sees that plate, it _will_ flag it each. and. every. time! Tomorrow, say an "Amber Ale…
How are all these dead baby seals Flock's fault? They simply released the Auto Baby Seal Clubber 9000 on beaches that have baby seals. It's the people that keep submitting "club baby seals" to the system that are the problem.
What I want to know is who is manufacturing these police cars that let these cops travel to execute unlawful warrants. "Oh, but it's not our fault. We just built due-process-violation machines. It's the police who are driving them to citizen's locations and violating due process." Come on.
Re: Flock cameras keep telling police a man who doesn't have a warrant has a warrant
#133Earlier quoted context omitted.
So?
Maybe the practice is what you would always want. Not me.
"The practice" in my comment is in fact what you, personally, would always want. Any other practice would have no way to work.
"The practice" in your comment is unrelated. Is there a reason you brought it up?
Re: Flock cameras keep telling police a man who doesn't have a warrant has a warrant
#134Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Flock is just doing what it is being asked to do! Well then clearly they are not a problem.
Hmm, I wonder what Flock proponents would say when immediately asked about guns, after all, it's just a machine doing what it is being asked to do!
Are we up in arms about gun manufacturers selling guns to the police because police sometimes misuse them?
Re: Flock cameras keep telling police a man who doesn't have a warrant has a warrant
#135when you use typos to broaden the scope of a warrant to include individuals that have not commited crime or acts prerequisite to indictment, you are exceeding the authority granted by a justice.
i would like to be privy to such discourse, as "your honour we need to include spellings of name or other identifiers, contrary to those of the person in the warrant you have issued."
Re: Flock cameras keep telling police a man who doesn't have a warrant has a warrant
#136Earlier quoted context omitted.
See: the TN woman who was extradited to NC, having never been there, for a crime that the AI "face recognition" flagged as her, and the cops did zero actual investigation, they just took the AI at its word and put her in jail for six months. As has been explained numerous times, this was a problem with the police and the courts, not AI. Get rid of bad cops first, then worry about AI.
Why not worry about the AI and work to try to get rid of bad cops? There is no sense in limiting yourself to doing the next-to-impossible task first.
People do have limits, and doing both is inherently harder than doing one. Every ounce of effort spent working on something that isn't the problem takes away from the effort to actually address the problem.
Re: Flock cameras keep telling police a man who doesn't have a warrant has a warrant
#137Paraphrasing the crux of the issue: "It's regular practice in Colorado to list license plates with both versions, the one with 'O's and the other with Zeros in the warrant list." Insane. Practice. As always, this story has have nothing to do with the cameras or AI, but "law enforcement has an insane lazy practice" doesn't make for a very good headline anymore.
For why, just glance at this.
https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2Fd...
(It's a Dungeon Crawler Carl-themed license plate.) Look carefully at the sticker at the top right. The tag is actually MONGON0, but it is far from obvious that the last character is a zero at a quick glance unless you are very familiar with the typeface used in Tennessee license plates.
The logical solution is to forbid issuing plates that could be misinterpreted. If MONGONO exists, then you can't have M0NG0N0 or other permutation of O's and 0's.
Re: Flock cameras keep telling police a man who doesn't have a warrant has a warrant
#138Earlier quoted context omitted.
"Law enforcement is setting up a multi-county dragnet by putting every version or mistype of a license plate into a warrant list" wouldn't be a story? It should be! We should have a higher standard for the people with guns and a badge on the street.
Flock is the problem too because their system is enabling the rights violations to scale up.
Flock can also fix this by validating the description of the target vehicle against the detected vehicle.
The dispatch backend can fix this by annotating this warrant with a warning that its not this particular vehicle.
Police themselves can fix this by being a human check on dumb entries in computer systems.
Re: Flock cameras keep telling police a man who doesn't have a warrant has a warrant
#139Earlier quoted context omitted.
Flock is the problem too because their system is enabling the rights violations to scale up.
Flock can also fix this by validating the description of the target vehicle against the detected vehicle. The dispatch backend can fix this by annotating this warrant with a warning that its not this particular vehicle. Police themselves can fix this by being a human check on dumb entries in computer systems.
As we've seen with multiple incidents across the country, police largely don't want to be a human check. They want the computer to tell them who to arrest, regardless of facts in reality.
Re: Flock cameras keep telling police a man who doesn't have a warrant has a warrant
#140Paraphrasing the crux of the issue: "It's regular practice in Colorado to list license plates with both versions, the one with 'O's and the other with Zeros in the warrant list." Insane. Practice. As always, this story has have nothing to do with the cameras or AI, but "law enforcement has an insane lazy practice" doesn't make for a very good headline anymore.
The net is telling me that since 1975 the license plate format in Colorado is XXX-XNN where Xs are letters and Ns are digits. Having a plate entered into the watch list with multiple times with all variations of substituting Os for 0s and 0s for Os should not cause a problem.
That suggests that this involves a plate that does not come from the normal sequence you get when you let the state choose your plate. It looks like most of their collector and special use plates also should be safe [1].
That's probably why we haven't heard of a lot of people running into this. It seems you probably would have to have a vanity plate that includes 0 or O, and someone else would have to have a vanity plate that differs from yours only by changing 0s to Os or vice versa.