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Personal Statement of a CIA Analyst

antipolygraph.org

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Re: Personal Statement of a CIA Analyst

#131

Post by Arainach »

coreyburnsdev wrote: post #120
Arainach wrote: post #59

I applied for an internship with the NSA. My understanding of the process (years ago, pre-Snowden) was that they did a pass on your resume (I can't recall if there was even a phone screen), then they started background checks and if there were N internships the first N people to pass the security clearance were selected. They went through the standard stuff, interviewing my neighbors, etc. Then they flew me to Fort M…

really? working with the nsa would probably be very interesting work!

You're not wrong. The NSA circa 2008 was probably doing some of the most algorithmically interesting CS work in the world. That said, I think that in terms of living with myself, sleeping well at night, and being able to travel the world without asking permission, not working there was the right call.

Re: Personal Statement of a CIA Analyst

#132

Post by bigiain »

enneff wrote: post #122
snickerbockers wrote: post #106

Oh boy, something on the HN front page i have direct personal experience with (CIA polygraph exams in general not this specific one). >Then she asked if I'd read about polygraphs. I said I'd just finished A Tremor in the Blood. She claimed she'd never heard of it. I was surprised. It's an important book about her field, I would have thought all polygraphers knew of it. They'll also ask you about antipolygraph.org whi…

> part of the polygraph test involves a blood pressure cuff which is put on EXTREMELY tight, far more so than any doctor or nurse would ever put it on. It is left on for the entire duration of the test (approximately 8 hours). My entire arm turned purple and i remember feeling tremors. Why would you subject yourself to this?

Some people clearly do it for their paycheck.

Re: Personal Statement of a CIA Analyst

#133

Post by prewett »

Stevvo wrote: post #49
apical_dendrite wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's an old interview on C-SPAN's BookTV with a CIA polygrapher. He seems to genuinely believe in the validity of the polygraph, but watching the interview, I was convinced that the only value comes from intimidation and stress. (all-caps bad transcription) > THE ESSENCE OF A POLYGRAPH TEST IS IF YOU HAVE SOMETHING TO LOSE BY FAILING A POLYGRAPH TEST IF YOU WILL, OR SOMETHING TO GAIN BY PASSING IT, THAT IS WHAT MA…

It sounds like religion; it only works if people believe in it.

Maybe Reformation religions require belief, but the paganism was a set of rituals known to work (by virtue of having worked before), sort of a like a spiritual experimental science. Belief was not required.

Religions don't necessarily work because people believe in it, either. There are a number of religious sects that started with end of the world prophecies.

I think that religions work the opposite way: people believe in them because they work. Since the purpose of religion is generally to explain the nature of reality and how to flourish in it, it needs to work for you. If it doesn't, you either just go through the motions, or quit and find a different religion (or swear off religion, which is sort of the same thing).

Re: Personal Statement of a CIA Analyst

#134

Post by Herring »

b00ty4breakfast wrote: post #48

I'm always surprised to hear that a government agency administers polygraph tests in something as serious as hiring but then I remember the CIA also spent millions of dollars trying to develop telekinetic assassins and train clairvoyants to spy on the Kremlin.

Actually it sounds more like hazing to me (unethical but not entirely irrational).

Re: Personal Statement of a CIA Analyst

#135

Post by DANmode »

unsnap_biceps wrote: post #66
delichon wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Knowing someone had committed petty theft is at least a red flag. I can't blame an employer for considering it disqualifying when they have many equally qualified candidates without it. Even for a burger flipper, let alone a secret agent.

We know nothing about the situation. It's entirely possible that the person took $50 from their parent's purse as a child. My parents used to love to tease me about the time I stole candy from the grocery store as a child. Is that a red flag?

Since you asked: How old of a child?

Re: Personal Statement of a CIA Analyst

#136

Post by DANmode »

keepamovin wrote: post #99
Arainach wrote: post #59

I applied for an internship with the NSA. My understanding of the process (years ago, pre-Snowden) was that they did a pass on your resume (I can't recall if there was even a phone screen), then they started background checks and if there were N internships the first N people to pass the security clearance were selected. They went through the standard stuff, interviewing my neighbors, etc. Then they flew me to Fort M…

At lesat now the IC has dirt on you should you ever step out of line.

Yeah, “help us into Yahoo Mail for a few years - or we’ll anonymously report to your mother the truth about where the coins came from”.

Re: Personal Statement of a CIA Analyst

#137

Post by NedF »

jMyles wrote: post #37
Animats wrote: post #31

I went through national-security polygraph exams twice, and they were no big deal. Filling out SF-86 (which used to start "List all residences from birth"), now that's a hassle. In my aerospace company days, almost everything I did was unclassified, but I was put through the mill of getting higher level security clearances so I could be assigned to classified projects. Fortunately, I never was.

I'm curious about how "residence" is defined for this purpose (and for many purposes). Often it's just presumed that people will know what a "residence" is, but I've lived many years of my life houseless, including on a skoolie. I never know what to say about my residence. Even now, I own a house, but I don't consider it my home, at least not all the time. Have a specific "residence" presumes that there's one set of…

[dead]

Re: Personal Statement of a CIA Analyst

#138

Post by DANmode »

anonymousiam wrote: post #71

Been there, done that. It's a good account, but I'm pretty surprised that the author felt that he could get away with "butt clinching", which is a form of deception, even when you're using it because you know the polygraph process is flawed. So he had to have lied to the investigator about whether or not he was being deceptive, and he never should have been cleared in the first place. My last few polygraphs (I've had…

> it was just too stressful for them.

Are you sure that’s the right word?

Maybe…too disrespectful? (Abusive, in your words.)

Re: Personal Statement of a CIA Analyst

#140

Post by knallfrosch »

I always thought the workings of polygraphs were common knowledge.

It's fiction. Analysts get scared and don't do anything wrong preemptively. Analysts admit stuff they'd never do otherwise. The agency gets to show who's in charge. It creates a legal fiction that allows you to abuse your employees. It creates a fiction that the abusers themselves can believe in.

Why should the believe in the non-working polygraph be any weaker than in a nonexistent god?

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