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Wisconsin communities signed secrecy deals for billion-dollar data centers

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Re: Wisconsin communities signed secrecy deals for billion-dollar data centers

#131

Post by delecti »

whizzter wrote: post #116
DalasNoin wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Space doesn't seem like a good place to build datacenters at all. Cooling is going to be an enormous issue, how do you disperse of heat in a vaccuum? Radiators are very ineffective for cooling.

Cooling is the biggest reason for space datacenters, heat is movement of particles and vacuum being an absence of particles, so it's by definition cold. Naturally the system needs energy, the sun giving radiation convertible to electricity should enable that. Both parts are documented about ISS https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrical_system_of_the_Inter...

Space is indeed very cold, but it does not cool you off very quickly. The lack of particles means it's harder to get heat away from yourself. Essentially all of the energy produced via solar panels would be converted to heat by the computers.

Re: Wisconsin communities signed secrecy deals for billion-dollar data centers

#132

Post by xborns »

I live near one of these projects by chance. It seemed like back door deals for land which some happened to be sold by a former Oracle exec then magically the tax district approved unanimously by For extra fun today the WI Realtors Association and other groups are suing the city to stop an upcoming vote from an accepted petition that forced approving projects over tax financed projects $10 million dollars get voter approval.

https://biztimes.com/mmac-sues-city-of-port-washington-over-...

Re: Wisconsin communities signed secrecy deals for billion-dollar data centers

#133

Post by madeforhnyo »

simianwords wrote: post #102
lossolo wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everyone were also betting on quantum computing and the hydrogen energy revolution. My napkin math says that, for a system at around 75°C, you would need about 13,000 square meters of radiators in space to reject 10 MW of heat.

why do you think they are betting on it if it so obvious to you that it won't work?

Just because some CEOs pour billions into fantasy projects it doesn't mean they're viable. Otherwise we all would be in the metaverse wouldn't we?

Re: Wisconsin communities signed secrecy deals for billion-dollar data centers

#134

Post by slfnflctd »

e40 wrote: post #128
miki123211 wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's more to NIMBY than "thrashing your land." The US seems to have a "tragedy of the commons" problem when it comes to NIMBYism. Everybody wants X to exist, but X causes some negative externalities for the people living close to it, so nobody wants X build specifically in their back yard, they want it but built somewhere else. Because the US seems to delegate these decisions to a much more local / granular level…

The idea that data centers have to be built near homes (or anywhere people live or work) is absurd. The US is huge and vast amounts of open spaces.

The people who work in the datacenters don't want a long commute.

Also, in a remote area, the third parties the owners require for continual maintenance will be fewer, take longer to respond, likely cost more, and may be less qualified than those you can find in a more populated area.

Re: Wisconsin communities signed secrecy deals for billion-dollar data centers

#135

Post by mkarrmann »

dguest wrote: post #39

I'd like to hear the argument for why this is needed. I can imagine a number of reasons, but this is all I found in the article: > If I’m a company considering making strategic investments... I don’t want my competition to know where I’m going, what I’m doing, what pace I’m doing it at... You want to make sure everything is buttoned up and bow tied before that type of information is put into the public realm. I'm hav…

Idk why it's hard to believe another company would try to outbid.

Discovering good locations for data centers is genuinely a difficult problem. They're relatively scarce. Bidding wars seem completely plausible.

Re: Wisconsin communities signed secrecy deals for billion-dollar data centers

#136

Post by simianwords »

madeforhnyo wrote: post #133
simianwords wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

why do you think they are betting on it if it so obvious to you that it won't work?

Just because some CEOs pour billions into fantasy projects it doesn't mean they're viable. Otherwise we all would be in the metaverse wouldn't we?

Sure, I don't claim all of them go well. Do you want to run a hypothetical exercise on how many they get right vs wrong? And based on that we can see if this is a "fantasy" or not?

Re: Wisconsin communities signed secrecy deals for billion-dollar data centers

#137

Post by lossolo »

simianwords wrote: post #102
lossolo wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everyone were also betting on quantum computing and the hydrogen energy revolution. My napkin math says that, for a system at around 75°C, you would need about 13,000 square meters of radiators in space to reject 10 MW of heat.

why do you think they are betting on it if it so obvious to you that it won't work?

Because it will inflate their stock valuations? It's like with fusion energy or going to Mars etc., constantly X years away and currently economically unfeasible.

Re: Wisconsin communities signed secrecy deals for billion-dollar data centers

#138

Post by simianwords »

lossolo wrote: post #137
simianwords wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

why do you think they are betting on it if it so obvious to you that it won't work?

Because it will inflate their stock valuations? It's like with fusion energy or going to Mars etc., constantly X years away and currently economically unfeasible.

why do you think their stock will inflate?

Re: Wisconsin communities signed secrecy deals for billion-dollar data centers

#139

Post by dguest »

miki123211 wrote: post #124
dguest wrote: post #39

I'd like to hear the argument for why this is needed. I can imagine a number of reasons, but this is all I found in the article: > If I’m a company considering making strategic investments... I don’t want my competition to know where I’m going, what I’m doing, what pace I’m doing it at... You want to make sure everything is buttoned up and bow tied before that type of information is put into the public realm. I'm hav…

There's more to NIMBY than "thrashing your land." The US seems to have a "tragedy of the commons" problem when it comes to NIMBYism. Everybody wants X to exist, but X causes some negative externalities for the people living close to it, so nobody wants X build specifically in their back yard, they want it but built somewhere else. Because the US seems to delegate these decisions to a much more local / granular level…

I think what you are talking about is called "tragedy of the anticommons" [1].

Who gets to decide if an airport or data center gets built is a complicated question. But there are other options to keeping one party in the dark via NDAs. On one extreme we have eminent domain, on the other there's just buying out the local community transparently.

[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragedy_of_the_anticommons

Re: Wisconsin communities signed secrecy deals for billion-dollar data centers

#140

Post by duped »

dguest wrote: post #39

I'd like to hear the argument for why this is needed. I can imagine a number of reasons, but this is all I found in the article: > If I’m a company considering making strategic investments... I don’t want my competition to know where I’m going, what I’m doing, what pace I’m doing it at... You want to make sure everything is buttoned up and bow tied before that type of information is put into the public realm. I'm hav…

> Whereas everyone here seems to assume it's to avoid NIMBY

Literally every data center project that gets announced near me gets protested at council meetings, petitioned, and multiple series of reddit/bluesky posts about the project.

It's hard to put into words for HN how deeply locals resent tech companies and AI. You could call it NIMBY, but the hatred is deeper than that.

The sentiment is "you have enough money, go away. Your business is fundamentally bad."

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